| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Smoogie |
I have been messing around making a few tunes lately, I have sent some submissions off to the PPF album but this tune WAS NOT sent off and has never been heard by many people before
Bit of Freeform with hard kicks and a female vocal I chored from somewhere
I have some other demos to put up but 4 have been sent off to Ken Masters so will not be uploaded until a later date
Peace
|
| latininxtc |
I don't know what the hell that was, but it wasn't freeform. |
| AceofSpades_Lorenzo |
there's like no structure & the synths seem to not go together well :xxxxx |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by latininxtc:
I don't know what the hell that was, but it wasn't freeform.
Old Skool Freeform |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by AceofSpades_Lorenzo:
there's like no structure & the synths seem to not go together well :xxxxx
Its not a Raverbaby tune |
| AceofSpades_Lorenzo |
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by AceofSpades_Lorenzo:
there's like no structure & the synths seem to not go together well :xxxxx
Its not a Raverbaby tune
Its not in key either! :D |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by AceofSpades_Lorenzo:
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by AceofSpades_Lorenzo:
there's like no structure & the synths seem to not go together well :xxxxx
Its not a Raverbaby tune
Its not in key either! :D
Is it supposed to be? |
| AceofSpades_Lorenzo |
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by AceofSpades_Lorenzo:
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by AceofSpades_Lorenzo:
there's like no structure & the synths seem to not go together well :xxxxx
Its not a Raverbaby tune
Its not in key either! :D
Is it supposed to be?
yeah, that's what makes music, music. otherwise it's just random sounds put together. :D
|
| latininxtc |
That's pretty much all it is, a bunch of random stuff put together. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it actually has to sound good. This does not. |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by latininxtc:
That's pretty much all it is, a bunch of random stuff put together. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it actually has to sound good. This does not.
Sounds fine to me |
| The Dopeman |
wtf did i just listen to?? |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
wtf did i just listen to??
Hardcore Freeform |
| latininxtc |
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by latininxtc:
That's pretty much all it is, a bunch of random stuff put together. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it actually has to sound good. This does not.
Sounds fine to me
Well to you that's probably all you care about. For you, you just created a masterpiece.
But since you posted it on here for the rest of us to listen to, we're going to have opinions, and right now you are 0-3 as far as fans of the track. |
| Shades |
hmmm no easy way to put this but...
freeform normally has an acid line somewhere.....
there is no percussion
there is no bassline
the vocal is out of key
if you enjoy it, dont let others put you off, but a little advice
really listen intently to a tune you really like & try to emulate it, do it bar by bar & down to last high hat, you'll be amazed just how much goes into making a good tune :) |
| Josephson_Junction |
Smoogie, your heart may be in the right place, but if you're going to take production (or any creative activity) seriously you should be willing to listen to what others say, as well as ask questions. Ignoring their feedback simply because it "sounds fine" to you will get you absolutely nowhere. |
| DJ_FunDaBounce |
I notice an improvement over previous works. Keep at it Smoogie. |
| The Dopeman |
quote:
Originally posted by Shades:
hmmm no easy way to put this but...
freeform normally has an acid line somewhere.....
there is no percussion
there is no bassline
the vocal is out of key
if you enjoy it, dont let others put you off, but a little advice
really listen intently to a tune you really like & try to emulate it, do it bar by bar & down to last high hat, you'll be amazed just how much goes into making a good tune :)
exactly and once you have a good idea of what your doing listen to your finished track over and over and pick out areas of the track that need improving thats how i do it most of the time |
| Elipton |
Okay, there are a couple of fundamentals which you need to get your head around Smoogie.
The first is the most important. Criticism is your friend. It can be a harsh thing to hear, but it's often right. It'll bring you down to earth when you'll need it the most, so listen to people who offer it to you.
The second is that every element in music plays for the same team. They work together and harmonize. You have each element doing its' own thing here. You have a melody that is out of tune with other riffs, a vocal that's out of tune with the whole track, and needs to be worked in so it works at the right tempo, a kick that is isolated without more percussion and bassline...
Unfortunately, what you're left with is an unstructured, out of tune track with empty anonymous gaps left by lack of percussion and bassline.
Freeform is flexible by definition. Unlike what shades said, it doesn't necessarily need acid, but there're elements it does need. Namely, bassline, ride, hat, whatever.
Im sure you're trolling us with this thread, and by submitting tracks to PPF you're just wasting Pauls time and making things more difficult than they should be, but if you're genuine listen to those who know what they're talking about. |
| latininxtc |
quote:
Originally posted by Elipton:
Im sure you're trolling us with this thread
Judging from the 5+yrs I've seen him post on here, it's sadly clear that he is not trolling us. |
| Elipton |
quote:
Originally posted by latininxtc:
quote:
Originally posted by Elipton:
Im sure you're trolling us with this thread
Judging from the 5+yrs I've seen him post on here, it's sadly clear that he is not trolling us.
Just out of pure curiosity, have you ever produced or felt that urge to learn? |
| Shades |
quote:
Originally posted by Elipton:
Freeform is flexible by definition. Unlike what shades said, it doesn't necessarily need acid, but there're elements it does need. Namely, bassline, ride, hat, whatever.
Acid used to be an element of freeform that defined it from uk hardcore. this is why i used the word normally  i do agree with everything else though.
but back to smooger.... there is quite a bit missing from your definition of freeform, no percussion means no fill's, no drum rolls or snare & clap rolls, which are essential in building a freeform or hardcore tune.
when you start out, the trouble is you need to be able to listen to music differently to produce, you need to learn to break a track down in your head & separate all the different elements playing at the same time, so you hear them as you would if they were played as a single entity, once your able to do that, then you can emulate a tune using the 'right' samples & sounds
you also need to take notice of track structure, as in: how many bars before the breakdown & what happens when in that time period, break it down, ask questions, how many bars before the bassline kicks in etc....
theres so much.....
to help with the tuning issues... practice with midi files or try & stay in the key of C & don't use Black notes, you'll get used to which notes sound good with each other, im sure there are samples in vengeance that are marked C to also help you stay in tune.
|
| Future_Shock |
quote:
Originally posted by DJ_FunDaBounce:
I notice an improvement over previous works. Keep at it Smoogie.
This was ****ing abysmal... But at least the lead wasn't out of time this time.
This is the thing... Everyone sucks major anus at producing when they start. But with criticism and re-evaluation and self-evaluation you can improve over a long period of time.
Your replies just show you're way too arrogant to think this is anything but fantastic and it is TERRIBLE. It's also an insult to Ken. Not to say you can't improve (everyone can - it's a learned skill) but you need to stop blowing off people's criticisms cos you're a twat.
End of. |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by Andy_Influx:
quote:
Originally posted by DJ_FunDaBounce:
I notice an improvement over previous works. Keep at it Smoogie.
Your replies just show you're way too arrogant to think this is anything but fantastic and it is TERRIBLE. It's also an insult to Ken. Not to say you can't improve (everyone can - it's a learned skill) but you need to stop blowing off people's criticisms cos you're a twat.
End of.
How was it an insult to Ken?
|
| The Dopeman |
i got a lot of help from people on here when i started to take production seriously (my tracks were nowhere near as bad as this) but comparing my older tracks to the tracks i make now they sound 1000x better than when i 1st started
if you like i could send you some bassline, melody, pads over in midi & wav format so you can get an idea of what i've learned but you should take any feedback you can get even if it is negative even if it means you have to start a track all over again that way you can eventually turn the negative into positive |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
i got a lot of help from people on here when i started to take production seriously (my tracks were nowhere near as bad as this) but comparing my older tracks to the tracks i make now they sound 1000x better than when i 1st started
if you like i could send you some bassline, melody, pads over in midi & wav format so you can get an idea of what i've learned but you should take any feedback you can get even if it is negative even if it means you have to start a track all over again that way you can eventually turn the negative into positive
Feel free to send what you want but I won't change my methods as I enjoy what I am doing and what I make, it might not be what everyone was but then I have always liked a different type of Hardcore to most people on here. Basslines will never be stronger than hard kicks and I will always use hard kicks
I have no interest to being signed to a label as a producer or follow the same lead that everyone else is doing which is why I have no interest in Hardcore anyway
|
| djDMS |
Flogging a dead horse here lads. |
| The Dopeman |
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
which is why I have no interest in Hardcore anyway
wait...what?
|
| DJ_FunDaBounce |
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
which is why I have no interest in Hardcore anyway
wait...what?
lol!
uh oh! |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
which is why I have no interest in Hardcore anyway
wait...what?
I have no interest in mainstream Hardcore that is being made now, in fact I haven't heard much new sit in the last 5 or 6 years after it was all the same shite coming out
I listen to Old Skool which happens to be real Hardcore. Even stuff from the mid 2000s is better than anything after CLXH1
|
| The Dopeman |
you obv aint listened to any of my stuff nothing mainstream about it all i listen to is old skool i've probably got more old skool hardcore than a lot of people on the site i have a whole 2TB external hdd dedicated to bouncy techno, old/nu skool gabber, happy hardcore etc |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
you obv aint listened to any of my stuff nothing mainstream about it all i listen to is old skool i've probably got more old skool hardcore than a lot of people on the site i have a whole 2TB external hdd dedicated to bouncy techno, old/nu skool gabber, happy hardcore etc
I think half of my computer is made up of music files, most being Old Skool from 1990-1997 and some early 2000s |
| Future_Shock |
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
i got a lot of help from people on here when i started to take production seriously (my tracks were nowhere near as bad as this) but comparing my older tracks to the tracks i make now they sound 1000x better than when i 1st started
if you like i could send you some bassline, melody, pads over in midi & wav format so you can get an idea of what i've learned but you should take any feedback you can get even if it is negative even if it means you have to start a track all over again that way you can eventually turn the negative into positive
Feel free to send what you want but I won't change my methods as I enjoy what I am doing and what I make, it might not be what everyone was but then I have always liked a different type of Hardcore to most people on here. Basslines will never be stronger than hard kicks and I will always use hard kicks
I have no interest to being signed to a label as a producer or follow the same lead that everyone else is doing which is why I have no interest in Hardcore anyway
*Sigh*
Smoogie this entire track is out of key. It's not music. Even your beloved old skool hardcore and bouncy techno is in key. He mentioned sending you midi files for the purpose of learning how music is composed so you can learn to compose one in key - in whatever style or genre you want.
Music being in key is a prerequisite, not a style or method. |
| Future_Shock |
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by Andy_Influx:
quote:
Originally posted by DJ_FunDaBounce:
I notice an improvement over previous works. Keep at it Smoogie.
Your replies just show you're way too arrogant to think this is anything but fantastic and it is TERRIBLE. It's also an insult to Ken. Not to say you can't improve (everyone can - it's a learned skill) but you need to stop blowing off people's criticisms cos you're a twat.
End of.
How was it an insult to Ken?
Because you're wasting his time by sending him stuff like this when we're TELLING you how to fix it - not even opinions just music FUNDAMENTALS.
He will not (and rightly so) release music that is out of key. We're telling you it's out of key and needs to be fixed for it to be music... You just don't want to listen. |
| Future_Shock |
quote:
Originally posted by djDMS:
Flogging a dead horse here lads.
And not in the good way!
Yes, i know, triple post. Suck a sponge. |
| lurker |
This is amazing. I'm gonna go throw out my HU CDs because this track exists and isn't on any of them. It's that good.
Absolutely phenomenal. |
| Elipton |
Absoluetly deluded. |
| latininxtc |
quote:
Originally posted by Elipton:
Absoluetly deluded.
lol what an entertaining read to wake up to!
as far as your question goes, the thought had crossed my mind, but I don't believe I have the patience for it. I barely had the patience to learn how to mix lol.
I have to have someone be there to show me the ropes because I couldn't see myself learning it all on my own. |
| The Dopeman |
quote:
Originally posted by latininxtc:
quote:
Originally posted by Elipton:
Absoluetly deluded.
lol what an entertaining read to wake up to!
as far as your question goes, the thought had crossed my mind, but I don't believe I have the patience for it. I barely had the patience to learn how to mix lol.
I have to have someone be there to show me the ropes because I couldn't see myself learning it all on my own.
i'd imagine you to be pretty decent i learned how to produce on my own i think thats how my music doesn't really sound like anyone else's maybe that's what smoogie is trying to do
|
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
i'd imagine you to be pretty decent i learned how to produce on my own i think thats how my music doesn't really sound like anyone else's maybe that's what smoogie is trying to do
It would be boring if everyone made the same stuff all the time which is what has happened to Hardcore over the last 10 or so years which is why, like I said, I don't listen to anything new now unless it stands out. I already know whats going to be on the next CLXH Cd before even buying it |
| Elipton |
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
i'd imagine you to be pretty decent i learned how to produce on my own i think thats how my music doesn't really sound like anyone else's maybe that's what smoogie is trying to do
It would be boring if everyone made the same stuff all the time which is what has happened to Hardcore over the last 10 or so years which is why, like I said, I don't listen to anything new now unless it stands out. I already know whats going to be on the next CLXH Cd before even buying it
You need to make it music before it sounds like anything else. The issue is, you've got a bunch of sounda together that dont work together. Its not any kind of music yet, because its not music.
Basslines, percussion and structure dont make it identical to all other music. You need to get the fundamentals learnt, then inject your creativity to make it different and unique. |
| ricHARDcore |
quote:
Originally posted by Elipton:
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
i'd imagine you to be pretty decent i learned how to produce on my own i think thats how my music doesn't really sound like anyone else's maybe that's what smoogie is trying to do
It would be boring if everyone made the same stuff all the time which is what has happened to Hardcore over the last 10 or so years which is why, like I said, I don't listen to anything new now unless it stands out. I already know whats going to be on the next CLXH Cd before even buying it
You need to make it music before it sounds like anything else. The issue is, you've got a bunch of sounda together that dont work together. Its not any kind of music yet, because its not music.
Basslines, percussion and structure dont make it identical to all other music. You need to get the fundamentals learnt, then inject your creativity to make it different and unique.
Totally agree with you! For me, i've been producing hardcore since 6 or 7 years now. My first attempt were not very good but this is part of the game. I loved it, but I've kept it for myself as I knew it was not good enough to be released. Since then, I've read a lot about it, took courses, took advice from my pairs etc.
That's a long way too go but now that I begin to do good tracks, I'm really proud of myself. Everybody would do music if it was an easy task.
Producing music is not something as easy as it seem to be. There's a lot of things to learn and you never stop to learn how to make your sounds greater.
For the part that you want to do music for you, I can understand you. I'm thinking the same but you have to understand that the music was there before you and it as evolve to what it is today. So, some basic rules are applying to all EDM, with some variations but you have to learn them. And it's the same for the chords my friends. It's not that bad.
When you will have get throught that, you will be able to apply your own style to it and then you'll have good comments.
I've been in the same situation a couple of years ago, friends were telling me to learn the basics. i took it badly because I'm emotional when it comes to my music. i have think about stopping but I didn't. I've took on myself and I took those comments as advices and now I can say that they were right about it.
If you post something, you need to take advices that people give you.
But never let it go, just keep on producing and you will get to it.
|
| i_rawtrax |
Hi Smoogie!
You seem to like it, so I would keep going with it mate!
You have some nice individual elements there. Just need to bring them together a bit and it will start sounding much better!
Like others have said; there is no structure to it. Try and build an intro before you introduce the main melody, so you can see it coming.
Throw in some high end percussion as well (hi-hats/a clap), it will sound much brighter then. The kick sounds lonely all on its own :)
The kick is nice and beefy, no need to keep dropping it in & out. Choose when it needs to come in, and then roll with it until you need the mix space.
Hope you keep going with it!
|
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by i_rawtrax:
Hi Smoogie!
You seem to like it, so I would keep going with it mate!
You have some nice individual elements there. Just need to bring them together a bit and it will start sounding much better!
Like others have said; there is no structure to it. Try and build an intro before you introduce the main melody, so you can see it coming.
Throw in some high end percussion as well (hi-hats/a clap), it will sound much brighter then. The kick sounds lonely all on its own :)
The kick is nice and beefy, no need to keep dropping it in & out. Choose when it needs to come in, and then roll with it until you need the mix space.
Hope you keep going with it!
Cheers for the feedback I have more tunes like this to come. I already have my own trademark style and some even better bassdrums to come as well. All my tunes will be hard, no softcore here lol
|
| maddkid53 |
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
wtf did i just listen to??
|
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by maddkid53:
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
wtf did i just listen to??
|
| The Dopeman |
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by maddkid53:
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
wtf did i just listen to??
i see no words!!! :O |
| Smoogie |
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
quote:
Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:
Originally posted by maddkid53:
quote:
Originally posted by The Dopeman:
wtf did i just listen to??
i see no words!!! :O
Neither did I lol
|
| Claxton |
You posted it in the wrong section mate. |
