 Note: You must be registered in order to post a reply.
To register, click here. Registration is free.
| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| arpz |
I haven't bothered submitting the event for this because there's no lineup yet but is anyone from here planning on going?
It has multiple 'brands' (I *hate* the way that term gets used) - HTID, Hardcore Heaven, The Only Way Is Hardcore, We Are Hardcore, Ravers Reunited, Hard as F**k and is being held at Leicester o2
What are people thinking? Will it be the saving grace?
burger van at midnight, anyone? :) |
| Cyrax |
That rave would be mega rammed and I need room to dance so I'm out |
| arpz |
Yeah I hate not being able to move as well :(
I'm getting too old and thought '**** it', if I get the right level of wrecked then it might just be bearable |
| wong |
Wish i was, but on NYE'S the wife prefers us to do things 'as a family' ..... F*ckin weirdo she is |
| djDMS |
I always work around new year so wouldn't be able to go even if I was interested.
The line up and the event itself should be fantastic but there's no way I could bring myself to go to a big event these days. Too many people, guaranteed bellends, I'm too old etc etc... |
| Elliott |
**** me, we really are a bunch of whiny old men on this forum. We're the "get off my lawn" ravers.
My excuse is that I'm infirm. The rest of you are just dinosaurs.
Come on, lads, get down with the kids.
In all seriousness though, the guys at big raves now are complete tubes (even more than before). I prefer being an armchair fan. Besides, I get to hang out with you dicks. HH.com users are probably the most intelligent hardcore fans on the planet. We're also probably the biggest fans of the music. I'm not even being sarcastic. |
| arpz |
We are the most intelligent fans of a scene comprising almost entirely of complete and utter mongs, fair play :)
|
| Elliott |
quote:
Originally posted by arpz:
We are the most intelligent fans of a scene comprising almost entirely of complete and utter mongs, fair play :)
Mate, I was trying to be diplomatic!
But yeah, that was pretty much what I meant.
We're kings of the retard castle, conductors of the short bus etc.
Btw, I'm listening to your Late 00s mix. Very obvious track selection but otherwise good stuff! Underrated era imo. Hardcore in 2016 makes '07-'09 look like paradise. I remember people ripping on HTID 3 so hard but with hindsight, that album was incredible compared to what came next. By people, I don't mean me. I always loved HTID 3. |
| The drunken scotsman |
I've been listening to some older hardcore that I found recently and even going back a few years to when the 'dubcore' sound first came about... that was much better than the shite around these days. Depressing. The lack of decent hardcore these days has left a pretty big gap in my life. |
| Elliott |
quote:
Originally posted by The drunken scotsman:
I've been listening to some older hardcore that I found recently and even going back a few years to when the 'dubcore' sound first came about... that was much better than the shite around these days. Depressing. The lack of decent hardcore these days has left a pretty big gap in my life.
Amen to that mate.
I've been saying this all along. Hardcore didn't really nosedive until after 2012. Sure, after 2010 the % of good tracks went down but there were still plenty of gems to be found. And even the stuff that sounded stupid at the time was great with hindsight. Like that Re-Con & Demand album. Hell, even that Squad-E album sounds good now. Guiding Light was a screamer and Evora was great too.
I'll quote myself here in a response to you in another thread:
quote:
Since our tastes are very similar, I can tell you that this year's releases have mostly been shite. It's just that the handful of survivors and stragglers left on this forum have learnt to adapt to the new sounds of hardcore.
Our preferred sound is dead. It's over. It was an incredble run and I'll never forget it. Some of the best moments of my life have had a hardcore soundtrack. I'm going to continue listening to '01-'12 hardcore until I'm far too old (if I live that long). I'll also keep producing tracks in that style (if only I was half-decent at the engineering part..). I'll do my bit to keep the magic alive. RIP though really.
I really think I've reached the end of the road as far as modern hardcore is concerned. No big deal though because I'm going to go back to completing my '00s label collection (over 300 complete labels and counting). I don't know what I'll do when I run out of the old stuff though!
Pretty sure I've got the biggest '00s digi collection on the planet. I've even got a Be The One master wav somewhere (no idea how I got it). Maybe I should make a thread where we all compare our collections. |
| arpz |
quote:
Originally posted by Elliott:
Btw, I'm listening to your Late 00s mix. Very obvious track selection but otherwise good stuff! Underrated era imo. Hardcore in 2016 makes '07-'09 look like paradise. I remember people ripping on HTID 3 so hard but with hindsight, that album was incredible compared to what came next. By people, I don't mean me. I always loved HTID 3.
Fair play, cheers. It's a bit of a 'crowd pleaser/anthem bashing' set I agree but that was pretty much my aim for those few mixes that cover an era. Also, a lot of my pre-digital tracks are super ropey sounding so that played a factor in my selection as well. I need to do a 95-98ish mix at some point, to fill the gap
I will take a second to remind everyone that HAS is a thing and that it's good people!
There's definitely a lot of shit tracks around, there's the occasional gem but it's very rare to find a track that gives you a lump in your throat like a lot of those oldies. I don't know how much of that is built out of memories and nostalgia, though. The new label Legitimate from D-Lyte is doing the 2000s Thin n Crispy type sound and has 4 or 5 releases so far but I am dying for some melancholic/epic vocal tracks that just haven't been put out (the closest I've found vocalwise is probably on the Technikore remix of Gregor Le DahL - Change from DJ Tools 5, that's definitely a keeper)
|
| The drunken scotsman |
quote:
Originally posted by Elliott:
quote:
Originally posted by The drunken scotsman:
I've been listening to some older hardcore that I found recently and even going back a few years to when the 'dubcore' sound first came about... that was much better than the shite around these days. Depressing. The lack of decent hardcore these days has left a pretty big gap in my life.
Amen to that mate.
I've been saying this all along. Hardcore didn't really nosedive until after 2012. Sure, after 2010 the % of good tracks went down but there were still plenty of gems to be found. And even the stuff that sounded stupid at the time was great with hindsight. Like that Re-Con & Demand album. Hell, even that Squad-E album sounds good now. Guiding Light was a screamer and Evora was great too.
I'll quote myself here in a response to you in another thread:
quote:
Since our tastes are very similar, I can tell you that this year's releases have mostly been shite. It's just that the handful of survivors and stragglers left on this forum have learnt to adapt to the new sounds of hardcore.
Our preferred sound is dead. It's over. It was an incredble run and I'll never forget it. Some of the best moments of my life have had a hardcore soundtrack. I'm going to continue listening to '01-'12 hardcore until I'm far too old (if I live that long). I'll also keep producing tracks in that style (if only I was half-decent at the engineering part..). I'll do my bit to keep the magic alive. RIP though really.
I really think I've reached the end of the road as far as modern hardcore is concerned. No big deal though because I'm going to go back to completing my '00s label collection (over 300 complete labels and counting). I don't know what I'll do when I run out of the old stuff though!
Pretty sure I've got the biggest '00s digi collection on the planet. I've even got a Be The One master wav somewhere (no idea how I got it). Maybe I should make a thread where we all compare our collections.
Agree with that. The best years for me were around 03-07. But from 08 to 2013 was still good and a lot of producers were still making regular tunes and releasing tracks frequently. During those years, my interest did waiver somewhat, but looking back now as I have been, there was still a decent amount of good tunes about. |
| CDJay |
See, as much as I don't like to engage here.... 2013. That's when we started our direct sale store.
We've put out more albums in that short time than there were in the previous 10 years.
There's a CLSM album, a Marc Smith album, a Brisk album, a Dougal & Gammer album, Happy Hardcore Underground, countless new artist albums. two major compilation albums and a bunch of leading label albums. Free EPs, store samplers, endless podcasts. Within two years, '13-'15. I'd argue that's the best curated content dump run the genre has had since the regular vinyl releases of long yesteryear.
We'll close the year with a UHD Blu-ray and major comp revival, and yes.... if you hate "the new sound" it'll definitely leave you cold if you approach it looking for a fight. That said, this happens every time there is a shift in style or soundset (and I really wasn't anywhere near as keen on the genericore of 2008 - 2011, or the dubcore stuff of 2011-2013 as some). Our role has shifted from being an alternative platform to the mainstream to whatever we're attempting now. I'd rather be pushing diversity, but atm the front line needs a boost so we'll direct attention to that.
I remain somewhat convinced that the major informed/articulate detractors (yes, you two, I actually do see where you're coming from here) are informed by affinity to the 00s. I've always been a child of the 90's and frankly I see more of that spirit in some of the stuff I'm sitting on than I did of nearly anything that featured on an AATW album. Some of the more house-tinted stuff unsurprisingly has pianos, melancholy and discordance that reminds me of Vibes & Wishdokta or golden era Force & Styles than simplistic hands-up-scouse-house-core.
Swings and roundabouts; it doesn't mean you care more about a genre; it shows an affinity that has a best before. That's fine, it's happened when 4-beat came in, it happened when vocals became predominant, it happened when the original trance elements came in (badly) in 98/99. It happened to me around 2006, and it happened to me even more so in 2012. Join the club; *your* golden era left me cold. 
CDJay
|
| CDJay |
Oh, and I will be at this event; it's a fairly important date in the diary for anyone who wants the genre to survive 'n thrive through '17 and beyond. UK side, anyway.
CDJay |
| Rodz90 |
quote:
Originally posted by CDJay:
Oh, and I will be at this event; it's a fairly important date in the diary for anyone who wants the genre to survive 'n thrive through '17 and beyond. UK side, anyway.
CDJay
How come you say that? I wouldn't be able to attend for pretty much all the reasons above, but if it's an important date for the genre then that could sway things.
|
| arpz |
CDJay - I'll try and buy you a drink if I see you!
Rodz90 - The event is being billed as the union of all the 'brands', last year we had two or three 'big' new years eve events, by the sounds of it, this'll be the only big NYE rave (for Upfront hardcore at least). I think the idea is to get everyone together to have a really excellent night. Obviously the number of willing ravers has been dwindling so I think it's to show what it can be like if everyone gets together. Something like that anyway. I don't really know why one event can be so important but those that probably know better than me say it can be, so I'm on it. |
| Elliott |
quote:
Originally posted by CDJay:
See, as much as I don't like to engage here.... 2013. That's when we started our direct sale store.
We've put out more albums in that short time than there were in the previous 10 years.
There's a CLSM album, a Marc Smith album, a Brisk album, a Dougal & Gammer album, Happy Hardcore Underground, countless new artist albums. two major compilation albums and a bunch of leading label albums. Free EPs, store samplers, endless podcasts. Within two years, '13-'15. I'd argue that's the best curated content dump run the genre has had since the regular vinyl releases of long yesteryear.
We'll close the year with a UHD Blu-ray and major comp revival, and yes.... if you hate "the new sound" it'll definitely leave you cold if you approach it looking for a fight. That said, this happens every time there is a shift in style or soundset (and I really wasn't anywhere near as keen on the genericore of 2008 - 2011, or the dubcore stuff of 2011-2013 as some). Our role has shifted from being an alternative platform to the mainstream to whatever we're attempting now. I'd rather be pushing diversity, but atm the front line needs a boost so we'll direct attention to that.
I remain somewhat convinced that the major informed/articulate detractors (yes, you two, I actually do see where you're coming from here) are informed by affinity to the 00s. I've always been a child of the 90's and frankly I see more of that spirit in some of the stuff I'm sitting on than I did of nearly anything that featured on an AATW album. Some of the more house-tinted stuff unsurprisingly has pianos, melancholy and discordance that reminds me of Vibes & Wishdokta or golden era Force & Styles than simplistic hands-up-scouse-house-core.
Swings and roundabouts; it doesn't mean you care more about a genre; it shows an affinity that has a best before. That's fine, it's happened when 4-beat came in, it happened when vocals became predominant, it happened when the original trance elements came in (badly) in 98/99. It happened to me around 2006, and it happened to me even more so in 2012. Join the club; *your* golden era left me cold.
CDJay
I want to clarify that I really respect your dedication to keeping "hardcore" (as an abstract concept -- let's not quibble over the definition) alive. I have huge respect for you going against both internal and external pressures and managing to stay afloat. I admire the HU project even if I think the music is mostly shit. And, obviously, that's not a criticism of you or HU specifically; it's a statement on the genre itself. I hope you don't take any of my hardcore-bashing as HU-bashing because that's definitely not the intent. You have your own form of integrity; the value schema might not match my own but what you're doing requires plenty of integrity nonetheless.
I can accept that the genre has just left me behind. I understand that most people hit their wall as hardcore evolves past their preferred sound in a narrowly-defined epoch but, frankly, this is a new feeling for me. I love everything from '93 old skool to '12 "snare seconds" UK hardcore. That's an incredibly broad spectrum that I'm on board with. But for some reason, I just can't abide the latest changes. I think it was when the role of the supersaw faded that hardcore really lost me. It's not happy anymore. It's not euphoric. It doesn't give you the tingles. Old skool piano riffs, top-notch happy hardcore and the many, many amazing tracks of the '00s could all do that (to me, their unifying factor was the feelings they could evoke). I got into this music because I could utterly lose myself in an almost trance-like state of happiness, even without pharmaceutical assistance. Now that's gone. And that is how I really judge the death of hardcore.
What I would've liked to have seen is a split in the scene. We've been there before with happy hardcore/jungle. Every major change in hardcore has had its own distinct identifier: old skool, happy hardcore, UK hardcore. But recently the evolution has been more insidious. Surely you can see that hardcore in 2016 sounds nothing like hardcore in 2007 (when I started listening). The problem is that there has been no split in nomenclature or the scene itself. This newer stuff has merely subsumed the late '00s sound so that there's no room for the latter in "hardcore" anymore. When everything changed, the people pulling the strings behind the scene (heh, accidental puns) should've had the decency to **** off and start their own genre with all-new labels and their own events. The rest of us could've carried on with the "UK hardcore" label and the supersaw-driven music it had come to entail. And then it would've been legitimate to carry on producing proper hardcore, instead of it being curtailed. Some of the blame obviously rests with the scene of dumbass zombie producers who will just try to copy whatever Styles and Gammer are doing at the present moment. They followed the pied piper and I refuse to believe that everyone wanted to move away from supersaw-driven hardcore of their own volition.
|
| CDJay |
You're very on-the-nose with one major factor; the second the bigger artists dictate that a sound is "old" or "new" then it's almost impossible to do much else. Fantastically the "production" argument is *STILL* going on, as if that's the problem. HEH! It truly is all a comedy of errors, I really would love to talk about things FAR more frankly than I generally am able to publically. Perhaps, next year, I'll finally be able to!
Other than that, as I said, I personally miss "proper rave" noises far more than super-saws, so I'll be fighting for that with HHU2
CDJay |
| Captain Triceps |
quote:
Originally posted by CDJay:
I personally miss "proper rave" noises far more than super-saws, so I'll be fighting for that with HHU2
CDJay
This, a thousand times. I don't expect happy hardcore to ever be the dominant sound again, I just wish there was more of it. |
| Elliott |
quote:
Originally posted by CDJay:
You're very on-the-nose with one major factor; the second the bigger artists dictate that a sound is "old" or "new" then it's almost impossible to do much else. Fantastically the "production" argument is *STILL* going on, as if that's the problem. HEH! It truly is all a comedy of errors, I really would love to talk about things FAR more frankly than I generally am able to publically. Perhaps, next year, I'll finally be able to!
Other than that, as I said, I personally miss "proper rave" noises far more than super-saws, so I'll be fighting for that with HHU2
CDJay
Exactly. Diversity has always been stifled and discouraged (directly and indirectly) within the scene. Hell, a lot of big names would love nothing more than to have complete hegemony over the major means of distribution as well as the major events/promoters (there are some very obvious examples with promoters this decade). There have always been power-grabs in this scene and people fighting for control. And that includes control over the very sound of hardcore itself. Of course, I don't need to tell you about any of that. You probably know a lot more than I do about specific examples, given your insider knowledge.
I hate the way that the scene has been spectacularly unhelpful in allowing the supersaw-driven '00s sounds to continue (and actively hostile to it in some ways). One particularly galling example stands out to me: Gammer once said something to me that basically amounted to "my old music was shit and you're an idiot if you liked it" -- it's on Facebook somewhere if you don't believe me. I would be fine if we had a situation where this modern EDM-inspired hardcore was allowed to co-exist with the older sounds but we don't and that's what makes me so angry and hyper-critical. There's clearly still a market for that classic CXH sound yet it's not being met. I don't believe that is because every single producer in the scene wanted to stop making it and move on. That's ********. Neither of us believe that. What happened to the sound was pure politics and politics should never have the ability to define art.
I think we have a lot of common enemies, my friend. Maybe in 10 years, HU can release a UKHU revival album for the sounds of last decade. Maybe.
For the record, I've always tried to approach everything in hardcore with an open mind. I liked that brief chillout-core thing that seemed to be happening for a while in ~2013 with Anything For You, Breeze's Home remix. I adored some of the more batshit tracks like Notek, I Know You, Don't Care. I enjoyed some of the more thoughtful excesses of dubcore/electrocore like Switch and Screwface. I rushed my tits off to Re-Con & Demand's more modern take on the genre in I'm Sorry, Good Feeling, Heart Bleeds (the latter is probably in my top 20 of the decade so far). I loved some of the stuff that was happening in that weird transition period between old and new like Future Fuzz, Sober, Coming Back To Me. Even new hardcore has had its moments: Fallen, Top Of The World, Free From Form. Point is that I'm not prejudiced. I'm all for diversity (not the F&D album though). I just don't want my favourite sound replaced completely.
The eponymous HU compilations were pure fire from 1 to 5. Like Gammer, you used to be good and now you are bad. ;)
|
| C-LIFE |
My Hotel booked getting tickets this weekend im going last one was mint at Leicester, hopefully a bit of Scott brown this year |
| skarr |
I'm going to hazard a guess at the line-up, ---- darren styles, dougal, gammer, hixxy , joey riot,squad e, kulbfiller, fracus n darwin with keyes, breeze, Scott Brown, scoot , vibes and livelee, al storm, Alex prospect , mc's storm whizzkid keyes wotsee obie finchy, obviously I don't know what the '1st time world exclusive back 2 backs' will be but I feel it's pretty safe to say that the line-up will be almost EXACTLY the same as the last 3 ravers reunited events bar maybe 1 or 2 people. |
| skarr |
Oh and Ben xtreme |
| skarr |
Maybe there will be a few new crews, like 'The rouge squad ' , 'The mucky merky UK hardcore patrol ' and 'The ultimate warriors ' but let's just wait and see...... |
| Cyrax |
quote:
Originally posted by skarr:
I'm going to hazard a guess at the line-up, ---- darren styles, dougal, gammer, hixxy , joey riot,squad e, kulbfiller, fracus n darwin with keyes, breeze, Scott Brown, scoot , vibes and livelee, al storm, Alex prospect , mc's storm whizzkid keyes wotsee obie finchy, obviously I don't know what the '1st time world exclusive back 2 backs' will be but I feel it's pretty safe to say that the line-up will be almost EXACTLY the same as the last 3 ravers reunited events bar maybe 1 or 2 people.
your close but HTID are involved so I would add :
Thumper
Ajay
Clarkey and Jekyll
|
| arpz |
lol, probably nailed the lineup tbh.
Supposedly its 97% complete, I assume that's a literal statistic and they've just got to firm up the actual last 3% and not just some figure they pulled out of their arses. |
| skarr |
And possibly Thumpa aswel as he's been bigging them up HARD on Facebook recently, but then again hardcore heaven are involved and we all know how much slamming vinyl should just leave the hardcore scene alone and just focus on drum n bass...... |
| skarr |
And maybe someone will write a massive essay before hand about how there going to retire and then announce there massive comeback at the nyd event...... |
| arpz |
Excited!
There was lots of discussion about a lack of Styles/Sy/Re-Con, and a lot of CDJay telling everyone how wrong they all are and sharing his prophetic wisdom. Any thoughts from this lot? |
| CDJay |
Bleating on about Sy, and what he has done/did do/can and/or will do, is utterly pointless and it's become a detriment on anything that happens going forward. If you were him, would you want "in"? No. Neither does he, it's self evident, and whatever led us to this point is less relevant now than that salient fact.
Recon clearly had enough of the entanglement whirlpool and related entitlement, thus forcing the TWR lot to become more self reliant which ultimately levels the playing field which I am *all* for.
Sink or swim. Fight or flight.
It's taken longer than I thought it would; the crash didn't really crunch metal as expected and the recovery of sorts has been staggered, muted and staccato. That said, 2017 is game on. I was ready to walk, even very recently, but now I've dug my heels in and it's "Batter-up!" buttercups
CDJay
|
| Thumpa |
I think its a good lineup! |
| Elliott |
quote:
Originally posted by CDJay:
Bleating on about Sy, and what he has done/did do/can and/or will do, is utterly pointless and it's become a detriment on anything that happens going forward. If you were him, would you want "in"? No. Neither does he, it's self evident, and whatever led us to this point is less relevant now than that salient fact.
Recon clearly had enough of the entanglement whirlpool and related entitlement, thus forcing the TWR lot to become more self reliant which ultimately levels the playing field which I am *all* for.
Sink or swim. Fight or flight.
It's taken longer than I thought it would; the crash didn't really crunch metal as expected and the recovery of sorts has been staggered, muted and staccato. That said, 2017 is game on. I was ready to walk, even very recently, but now I've dug my heels in and it's "Batter-up!" buttercups
CDJay
I think Sy's story will always be relevant as a shining example of how immature, irresponsible and ****ed up the hardcore scene can be.
Plus many of us, rightly, still feel angry that one of our favourite producers and DJs was forced out of the scene and out of a collaboration that spawned countless amazing tracks over the years. I'm still bitter about the break-up of Sy & Unknown for sure. Neither of them has exactly set the world alight since their split. It's clear that they had to come as a pair. |
| Captain Triceps |
Yeah but we got Klubfiller now though! |
| Elliott |
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Triceps:
Yeah but we got Klubfiller now though!
That's true mate. How did I forget?
Oh, that's right, I was trying to. |
|
|
