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silver
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Japan
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  07:25:09  Show profile View artist profile Send a private message  Visit silver's homepage
Poll question:
Hardcore's artists and labels are laying down the law to unlicensed CD and tape packs what do you think?
Choices:
It's great - artists & labels will now get paid
I don't really understand the problem
Keep it illegal

View results




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Underloop
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United Kingdom
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  09:55:03  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit Underloop's homepage
I've already stated my views on this..... artists should receive the money they deserve IMO.

I mean its not even like they are getting any promotion as tracklistings aren't included so nobody knows what the tunes actually are unless they go to the effort of asking around on a site like this.

The situation needs sorting out, but losing tape/cd packs altogether would be a huge shame! Even worse would be if Slammin' decided enough was enough and packed it all in!

Matthew aka DJ Underloop


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we grow old because we stop playing."
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GregE
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Australia
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  10:17:01  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit GregE's homepage
well i think it is a load of horse shit and people geting greedy.
the following is a listing in aussie $
1, DJ buys 20 records (bout $20 each of which AT LEAST $10 would go to the record company)
2, DJ produces a mix CD (no $$$ to record company, also no money to DJ)
3, DJ mixes at a party, othere DJ's hear tracks/mixing and go off and buy record (X*$10 to record lables)
5, DJ makes mix CD and SELLS IT FOR A PROFIT now THIS is where royalities should be paid, not before. now by this i dont mean a local web site selling for like $5-10 that does not make a profit if u factor time and costs in...

I have talked to a number of international DJ's/ DJ's that are making some form of a living out of what they do...all of these people agree, to mix it u got to have it....that simple and if u arnt making a profit with it then how in hells name are u expected to pay royalities??? the end resuult of this will be that the price of dance music events will go up and attendances go down...who wants that???
silver u didn't put an option for "thinks its a load of horse shit and people being to greedy" so i didn't vote.....

Greed is an evil weed
Once u plant its seed
it is hard to get rid of indeed....
OUT
GregE
PS it is goin to cost record companies more in the long run processing the requests to play their tracks...


I EAT KANGEROOS!!!


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Edited by - GregE on 2004/02/02 10:24:31
mrc
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United Kingdom
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  10:40:39  Show profile  Send a private message
i have voted i dont understand, i mean i understand the situation, just not the problem.

Hardcore Music represents itself with very little advertising, the tape pacs are a great form of free ad! I bet u dont hear many up and comers pushing this as it only benifits those at the top and it wont benifit us as the consumer cuz u dont get a variety of hardcore w/o tape pacs.

I hope this doesent spell the end for tape pacs cuz itll all have be vinyl, No offence but the CD's that have come out reasently have kept me interested for about...hhhmmm.....10 mins.

oh s*it man, what was i saying?


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oh s*it man, what was i saying?


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djDMS
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United Kingdom
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  10:46:02  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit djDMS's homepage
Producers/labels deserve recognition and should be paid what they're entitled to - it's that simple.

I can't understand those people who say 'they get paid for DJ'ing etc etc so they shouldn't mind'.

Rubbish.
Why should Events profit from somebody elses work?





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GregE
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Australia
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  11:10:49  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit GregE's homepage
ok, so you are willing to pay an extra $400 per event that you go to??? considering that most of it is goin to the record companies and you will have the same DJ's and same sound lights etc etc ???
mrc has hit the nail on the head, mix CD's are the best advertising ever, if they want $$$$$ encrypt all CD releases that are sold for a profit, and rain in royalities that way
OUT
GregE


I EAT KANGEROOS!!!


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The people are real, the conversations are cod shite, the rulings are final
This is Judge GregE


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Edited by - GregE on 2004/02/02 11:15:04
Underloop
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  11:56:28  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit Underloop's homepage
quote:
Originally posted by djDMS:
I can't understand those people who say 'they get paid for DJ'ing etc etc so they shouldn't mind'.



Yeah, I'd just like to put forward the argument agains the getting paid for DJing case. Lets take a typical HH night (the upcoming Valentine's gig):

DJs playing:
Scott Brown
Hixxy
DJ Sy
Darren Styles
Mark EG
Kevin Energy
Billy Bunter
Outblast & King Matthew
Slipmatt '95 Classics Set

Paul Glazby
Mark EG
Brisk
Breeze
Simon Underground
M-Zone
Jon Doe
D-Ice & Reality

OK, great, so all the big labels will be compensated (Raverbaby, Evo, NG/BB, Nu Energy etc) However, what about all the smaller labels that really need the cash injection in order to keep their label open for business? Labels such as DFM, Digital Beatz, Masterwax, Warped Science etc. I also notice that Essential Platinum isn't represented so no money will come to them even indirectly from the sale of tape packs.

And forgetting about the labels, what about the artists who don't DJ? Absolutely zip, diddley squat, sweet F.A., zilch, nadda etc....

Right, I hope, has quoshed (pun intended! ) another argument for licencing on tape packs.

I wasn't sure on the figures before, but Silver posted in another thread that 18% of the price is payable for royalties. That ain't too bad surely Slammin? allowing for £12 per unit manufacturing and distribution (which I am sure is a being generous) then that still leaves £4 profit per unit which ain't bad at all really!

Matthew aka DJ Underloop


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"We don't stop playing because we grow old;
we grow old because we stop playing."
- George Bernard Shaw


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Dj Vapour
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United Kingdom
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  12:03:05  Show profile View artist profile  Send a private message
the only problem with licencing tracks for Tapepacks would be each dj writing down what they played on paper and what label its on
there may even be tunes that arnt signed anywhere yet that are played
it can get messy





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silver
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Japan
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  12:24:19  Show profile View artist profile  Send a private message  Visit silver's homepage
^^^ There would be an artist that made the tune, so if the track is not signed yet the artist would get the money... Easy as....

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it's all hardcore.




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Underloop
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  12:44:36  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit Underloop's homepage
quote:
Originally posted by Dj Vapour:
the only problem with licencing tracks for Tapepacks would be each dj writing down what they played on paper and what label its on
there may even be tunes that arnt signed anywhere yet that are played
it can get messy







My understanding was that you are supposed to do that anyway for the PRS licence for the event..... is this wrong?

Matthew aka DJ Underloop


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"We don't stop playing because we grow old;
we grow old because we stop playing."
- George Bernard Shaw


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djDMS
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  12:55:50  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit djDMS's homepage
quote:
Originally posted by GregE:
ok, so you are willing to pay an extra $400 per event that you go to??? considering that most of it is goin to the record companies and you will have the same DJ's and same sound lights etc etc ???
mrc has hit the nail on the head, mix CD's are the best advertising ever, if they want $$$$$ encrypt all CD releases that are sold for a profit, and rain in royalities that way
OUT
GregE


I EAT KANGEROOS!!!





Fine, but even if a DJ was going to release a mix CD he'd licence the tracks anyway - and it would more than likely be predominantly his music.
If somebody else decided to sell it without anybody's permission it would be wrong.

END OF


I look forward to you giving me all your work/ideas for me to sell at a profit.
Cheers!




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Leelo1
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United Kingdom
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  13:28:37  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit Leelo1's homepage
i dont think itll be a very dramatic change ppl will still do it they just wont sell em in shops but keep em more and more underground

i belive the dj should make his money bac but not a pis*takin profit they deserve respect

DO NOT DISTURB DJ IN PROGRESS
Leelo_1


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OI
Dont tell mom am double dropping


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GregE
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Australia
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  13:39:41  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit GregE's homepage
my argument is this, Dj's make mix CD's (that is mix record it to CD in there house) then GIVE it out...for them to pay royalities is just unreasonable, it it wasa simple request to put the track names artist etc etc on back then i can understand but the whole licenceing thing is just excessive.
If u Dj at a gig and u have a contract then by rights u should ensure your lable is on the flier (thus more free advertising for record companies) and if a DJ mixes well with a variety then it encourages others to buy tracks etc etc MORE advertising "gee i wonder where those tunes came from they were really cool, OH i know there was a lable on the flier i will go online/to my store and have a look for stuff on that label"
but yeah if u are selling the things for a profit and once again that aint just covering cost but mass producing and selling on a comercial basis that will make substantial profit then yes as i said royalities must be given.
As for the "not haveing a great effect" down here in aussie land peoples are now shitting themselves about putting out mix CD's and yeah it is really quite disturbing...
OUT
GregE

I EAT KANGEROOS!!!


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The people are real, the conversations are cod shite, the rulings are final
This is Judge GregE


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Dj Vapour
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United Kingdom
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  13:43:32  Show profile View artist profile  Send a private message
quote:
Originally posted by silver:
^^^ There would be an artist that made the tune, so if the track is not signed yet the artist would get the money... Easy as....

__________________________________
it's all hardcore.



oh yeah !







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Simon
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  14:49:23  Show profile  Send a private message  Visit Simon's homepage
I'm staying out of this one (see first time for evrything ), I don't believe that either argument is correct, or incorrect to be honest, this one will run and run (like the Hutton inquiry), everyone knows the morale answer, but is the morale answer always the right answer. Obviously I don't know and/or understand ALL the FACTS so I can't make a fair judgement either way. So I'm gonna sit on the fence for this one.

I think this argument goes a lot deeper than I (The average music fan) can possibly imagine!


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"Hush little baby, don’t say a word
And never mind that noise you heard
It’s just the beast under your bed,
In your closet, in your head"


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Edited by - Simon on 2004/02/02 14:53:52
DJ Mouse
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United Kingdom
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Posted - 2004/02/02 :  23:37:21  Show profile  Send a private message
right so first they go out and play their tunes made a few days before and still expect royalties?

they've managed before without any so they can still do it.

also whether the tape packs are licensed or not they're an ultimate promotion tool. and when we see a load disappear coz the price has been bumped so high no one will buy the packs,the dj's will start to miss out coz not as many have heard the tracks leading to not as many buying it.


--------------------------------------------------
"I had 2 half-brothers and they both died, so Mummy took the chainsaw off me"

DJ Mouse
http://hardcorehq.tk


ps. if ya think you can live off royalties then think again. its something like a few pence per unit, and in a scene like ours not many units will be sold. not worth the effort.


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Edited by - DJ Mouse on 2004/02/02 23:42:33



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