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| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Alabaster |
I was intrigued by comments in this thread: http://www.happyhardcore.com/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=75374 about Gammer's mixing style. I always thought the idea with hardcore was to mix as fast as possible whilst still keeping it listenable to. Was I wrong? When do you tend to mix out of a track? |
| djDMS |
I think promo mixes and live sets should show what a DJ can do, and if that's quick mixing, great. But, sometimes people just want to hear the tunes (especially if they're really good ones). Often, if a tune appears on a mix/album months before release, it can be frustrating to only hear a bit of it.
Personally I can live with either, but I prefer getting lots into a mix, but I buy unmixed stuff that I can listen to all the way through anytime. |
| Samination |
I've only really tried quickmixing on Makina and Gabber (they are more lenient to that kind of mixing... or I just suck mixing british Hardcore that way :P)
Makina, a style that is usually mixed on 3 decks in Spain, is definitly a style that allows for quick mixing. I usually start the intro for the incoming track just when the melody starts after the first breakdown. Makina usually has a quieter section just after the first main section, which is usually where the incoming track's melody starts.
Gabber or Dutch Hartdcore on the other hand, is pure chaos. As long as it doesn't clang you can almost play tracks into eachother.
I'm not a technical DJ so I usually refrain from quickmixes, but when I can get them to work they're usually marvelous |
| Mortis |
Both have their place imo. A nice mix of the two during a set is always good. |
| GrahamC |
See, I always took it to mean the 'joins' between the tracks, i.e. how long you play the records together. When I listen to Gammer's more recent mixes, on the D&G Album, the HU Album and the new Music Mondays one he did, there is not much evidence of actual mixing, seems to rattle from one track to another with a sound effect or stutter. Perfectly in time obviously but it is like setting up the next record to be in time and instead of playing them together, mixing, he is slamming the fader from one deck to the other.
Appreciate there is a lot of tracks on these albums and if there was overlap for all the tracks you could not fit as many on.
That said, the whole point of getting a CD mixed by Gammer or any of the other big names, is to hear their skill on the decks/Ableton but this style of non-mixing, thats the easiest thing in the world, clack-done! I want to hear the tracks blend one into the other. Brisk's Album mix is the best recent example I can think of! |
| Vladel |
I like quick mixing if the tracks are mixed for quite a bit. Fast fade in and fade out definitely not. Albums need a good length but anything else just needs to be good mixing and that gammer cd is lazy from what i hear |
| Guest |
quick mixing says your shit and can`t mix, you might aswell just chop over to the next tune
i have to be using loops to sort my mixes out, otherwise there aint no point in mixing, or spending more then a few hundred quid on some decks
Gabber or Dutch Hartdcore is just hardcore, not chaos, its just the mid 90s with sub bass, there are shit uk hardcore events, and how it is all round europe with all those festivals to itself and chicks in hotpants n shit
only have to listen to korsakoff, restyle and anime, etc who play at the events |
| Captain Triceps |
quote:
Originally posted by Guest:
Gabber or Dutch Hartdcore is just hardcore, not chaos, its just the mid 90s with sub bass, there are shit uk hardcore events, and how it is all round europe with all those festivals to itself and chicks in hotpants n shit
You're right, quick mixing can have its place sometimes. |
| Samination |
I mean't that the harder Hardcore is more chaotic in nature (not in structure or in genre name), which kinda allows it for mixing it poorly (as long as it doesn't clang our sound out-of-sync too much) |
| wong |
both |
| Guest |
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Triceps:
quote:
Originally posted by Guest:
Gabber or Dutch Hartdcore is just hardcore, not chaos, its just the mid 90s with sub bass, there are shit uk hardcore events, and how it is all round europe with all those festivals to itself and chicks in hotpants n shit
You're right, quick mixing can have its place sometimes.
not really, quick mixes defeat the point of all the tunes saying out to all the real dj`s, im the dj, dj in the blocks, and all the other shiz
quick mixes are rubbish when drunk, stoned, on speed, or anything, most people in a club will stop and think shit mix |
| Captain Triceps |
quote:
Originally posted by Guest:
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Triceps:
quote:
Originally posted by Guest:
Gabber or Dutch Hartdcore is just hardcore, not chaos, its just the mid 90s with sub bass, there are shit uk hardcore events, and how it is all round europe with all those festivals to itself and chicks in hotpants n shit
You're right, quick mixing can have its place sometimes.
not really, quick mixes defeat the point of all the tunes saying out to all the real dj`s, im the dj, dj in the blocks, and all the other shiz
quick mixes are rubbish when drunk, stoned, on speed, or anything, most people in a club will stop and think shit mix
That's more or less the point I was trying to make. |
| warped_candykid |
I prefer long transitions with lots of tricks and treats! Many tracks today just aren't structured with interesting intros/outros. We've also gone from 6-7 min. tracks, down to 4 min tracks, so the 'traditional' mixing style just isn't as present. |
| Samination |
quote:
Originally posted by warped_candykid:
I prefer long transitions with lots of tricks and treats! Many tracks today just aren't structured with interesting intros/outros. We've also gone from 6-7 min. tracks, down to 4 min tracks, so the 'traditional' mixing style just isn't as present.
Well that's kinda obvious with CDs, where you dont need to place the needle on the right spot and have 1 min to correct it :P |
| Captain Triceps |
quote:
Originally posted by warped_candykid:
I prefer long transitions with lots of tricks and treats! Many tracks today just aren't structured with interesting intros/outros. We've also gone from 6-7 min. tracks, down to 4 min tracks, so the 'traditional' mixing style just isn't as present.
Yeah, how fucking boring is it when there's a 32 beat intro of nothing but kicks, then the breakdown. I mean they don't all need to be freeform-eqsue intros, with 3 minutes of in your face music before the first breakdown, but I do miss recognisable intros, the ones with a distinctive stab pattern or bleeps or something so you know what's coming. It's just the way things are now, it's not necessarily bad. |
| Guest |
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Triceps:
quote:
Originally posted by Guest:
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Triceps:
quote:
Originally posted by Guest:
Gabber or Dutch Hartdcore is just hardcore, not chaos, its just the mid 90s with sub bass, there are shit uk hardcore events, and how it is all round europe with all those festivals to itself and chicks in hotpants n shit
You're right, quick mixing can have its place sometimes.
not really, quick mixes defeat the point of all the tunes saying out to all the real dj`s, im the dj, dj in the blocks, and all the other shiz
quick mixes are rubbish when drunk, stoned, on speed, or anything, most people in a club will stop and think shit mix
That's more or less the point I was trying to make.
long mixes are abvoiusly better, more so for hardcore, if you have traktor, you can set the next loop hot cue active when the play marker reaches the hot cue
like this mix out, and what mixing is made for https://youtu.be/AoDGyijrzlg?t=20m17s and a whole lot better in a club or outdoor festival
you have 8 hot cues, it best to go through and set loops at the start and end of tracks, but then NI to too patheticly shit, to localize all your files on a usb stick so you can take it all to a club, like pioneer rekord box full dj app will do
dont have to go through tracks if you have a VMS4.1 and my mapping, it will so everything, except finding other tracks to load
so if any of you use my mapping, just press the reloop button, and the next loop hotcue will become active, even in traktor 2.7 when its suppose to be broken |
| Guest |
so if you have a VMS4.1, you can use a mouse speed switcher, and set VMS4.1 touchpads to 4x the desktop of your desktop mouse to zip about traktor etc browser and use the touchpad buttons to load tracks
http://sourceforge.net/projects/automousesw/ |
| Captain Triceps |
quote:
Originally posted by Guest:
so if you have a VMS4.1, you can use a mouse speed switcher, and set VMS4.1 touchpads to 4x the desktop of your desktop mouse to zip about traktor etc browser and use the touchpad buttons to load tracks
http://sourceforge.net/projects/automousesw/
You've answered my next three questions, cheers. |
| _Jay_ |
quote:
Originally posted by djDMS:
I think promo mixes and live sets should show what a DJ can do, and if that's quick mixing, great. But, sometimes people just want to hear the tunes (especially if they're really good ones). Often, if a tune appears on a mix/album months before release, it can be frustrating to only hear a bit of it.
Personally I can live with either, but I prefer getting lots into a mix, but I buy unmixed stuff that I can listen to all the way through anytime.
I know you love my long mixing style. In fact, I was thinking just recent, actually, that I might start playing each track in a mix twice, consecutively, just to make sure the listener really gets to hear every track properly.
|
| Guest |
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Triceps:
quote:
Originally posted by Guest:
so if you have a VMS4.1, you can use a mouse speed switcher, and set VMS4.1 touchpads to 4x the desktop of your desktop mouse to zip about traktor etc browser and use the touchpad buttons to load tracks
http://sourceforge.net/projects/automousesw/
You've answered my next three questions, cheers.
its best to look around, because that program is abit rubbish to some to "might" have to pay for
this is free to use http://www.gphotoshow.com/mouse-speed-switcher.php but you get a nag screen if you don`t buy it |
| djDMS |
quote:
Originally posted by _Jay_:
quote:
Originally posted by djDMS:
I think promo mixes and live sets should show what a DJ can do, and if that's quick mixing, great. But, sometimes people just want to hear the tunes (especially if they're really good ones). Often, if a tune appears on a mix/album months before release, it can be frustrating to only hear a bit of it.
Personally I can live with either, but I prefer getting lots into a mix, but I buy unmixed stuff that I can listen to all the way through anytime.
I know you love my long mixing style. In fact, I was thinking just recent, actually, that I might start playing each track in a mix twice, consecutively, just to make sure the listener really gets to hear every track properly.
The only 'DJ' whose mixes sound like unmixed compilations! |
| Vladel |
I buy unmixed so I can either listen to the full track or make my own mixes exactly as I want with whatever tracks I want but I'm definitely not a dj. |
| jordesuvi |
I wouldn't dismiss quick mixing, I think it's great. Especially in energetic genres.
Also, I'd generally view wanting to hear a full track at show as a dated concept. If the DJ is on a for a few hours then sure, let the mixes be long while he takes you on a musical journey of seamless blends and transitions.
DJ's booked from 45-60 minutes do have to cram in a lot of music, from their hits to little gems or fan favourites from other producers to keep the hype and interest in their set.
Plus with musical ADHD on the rise, it makes sense that quick mixing should be more occurent. |
| Alabaster |
quote:
Originally posted by jordesuvi:
I wouldn't dismiss quick mixing, I think it's great. Especially in energetic genres.
Also, I'd generally view wanting to hear a full track at show as a dated concept. If the DJ is on a for a few hours then sure, let the mixes be long while he takes you on a musical journey of seamless blends and transitions.
DJ's booked from 45-60 minutes do have to cram in a lot of music, from their hits to little gems or fan favourites from other producers to keep the hype and interest in their set.
Plus with musical ADHD on the rise, it makes sense that quick mixing should be more occurent.
I generally like the long 'musical journey' type sets you mention, but I think that style of mixing work better with less frantic genres. For me speedy mixing suits hardcore as well as most hard genres generally. The energy and speed of the mixing compliments the energy and speed of the music. |
| Laser |
I utilize looping a lot so I believe it's possible for on the spot mashups :3
I've noticed, however, I do a lot better when I use gain slider transitions than crossfader. It just makes sense. |
| Alabaster |
quote:
Originally posted by Laser:
I've noticed, however, I do a lot better when I use gain slider transitions than crossfader. It just makes sense.
Same, I wonder if it's possible to mix hardcore on a rotary mixer... |
| Samination |
for my latest mix (Mix 59), i actually thought that the quick mixes ruined the tracks i played. I think it went much better when i didnt do as many quickmixes on it as i usually do. |
| ViolonC |
I guess they both have their place regarding connecting the next track and regarding the crowd you are playing to.
Some tracks just don't blend well together even if they can function very well after another. As a musician i might be a little more picky but i really hate it if the keys don't match up and even more if there is not another element that connects the tracks. So a short transition is a better option for that to not make ears bleed.
Some crowds just want to dance and have a nice overall package. But sometimes it's just hearing the tunes they know. So no point in playing something less known and even better putting as much as possible in what they know. Because such a crowd doesn't care about elaborate mixing techniques. On the other hand you have to spent more consideration on your track list, something thats sometimes overlooked (or rather silently expected) but essential for a good DJ.
I think it's nice that you can do both very well in Hardcore. I'm spinning Trance and House from time to time and they kinda demand long, gradual transitions with only the new "EDM" shit allowing/demanding sucker transitions. |
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