TheOneNOnly Advanced Member
United States
1,937 posts Joined: Oct, 2008
Posted - 2010/01/10 : 18:02:51
Why would it scare me?
People choose their religion, not me. Why would I be scared of them becoming Muslim. Not everybody who is Muslim are terrorists and suicide bombers, and believe in what Osama is doing. And to think that is being ignorant.
Culture always changes, the video pointed that out. If you think what you see today is how it's always going to be, then, again, you're being ignorant. As long as I'm not infringed upon by any increasing rate of any religion than I could care less.
You can always try to predict the future, doesn't mean it's going to be true. Whose to say by time the Muslim religion hits a critical point that China won't burst onto the scene as THE world power, and might cause a new genocide? You can't say it won't happen, and you can't say it will happen.
All this talk about being afraid of Muslims just makes me sick. The Christian and Catholic Church are FAR from being ANY less cruel then SOME of the Muslims in this world in it's life time (note I don't say everyone following Christianity and Catholicism, but just what the Church itself has done in the past).
Tired of people putting down a religion because of a few "bad eggs".
quote:Islam
"None of you [truly] believes until he wishes for his brother what he wishes for himself." Number 13 of Imam "Al-Nawawi's Forty Hadiths."
Alert moderatorEdited by - TheOneNOnly on 2010/01/10 18:05:28
Ionosphere Advanced Member
United Kingdom
3,750 posts Joined: Dec, 2004
Posted - 2010/01/10 : 18:11:29
Well, two things spring to mind -
It has been said that Capitalism and the selfish consumerism that it encourages causes people to chase their own selfish dreams and personal gain.
Having a family is not the way to attain those goals. That means less children and also takes our eye off the ball.
It has also been said that the World, as we know it, doesn't have long to go before cataclysm.
That will be the world that the next most populous culture will inherit.
Therefore, it has been suggested, that this can be regarded as poetic justice....
whispering Moderator
Finland
8,453 posts Joined: Nov, 2002
Posted - 2010/01/10 : 18:25:08
quote:Originally posted by TheOneNOnly:
Why would it scare me?
As i pointed out, theres the conspiracy theory that islam is "taking over" europe by means of reproduction. This will effect the world your children and grand children will live in.
Saying its ignorance from my part to ask the question, is something i dont understand? To me it seems like a very good chance of having a negative effect on human and womens rights for starters. No i am not talking about terrorists, i'm talking about piece by piece getting back to medieval times, so to speak: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7232661.stm
quote:Originally posted by TheOneNOnly: Culture always changes, the video pointed that out. If you think what you see today is how it's always going to be, then, again, you're being ignorant. As long as I'm not infringed upon by any increasing rate of any religion than I could care less.
...and from that stems my question. Do you think the direction of Europe is scary or not.
quote:Originally posted by TheOneNOnly: All this talk about being afraid of Muslims just makes me sick. The Christian and Catholic Church are FAR from being ANY less cruel then SOME of the Muslims in this world in it's life time (note I don't say everyone following Christianity and Catholicism, but just what the Church itself has done in the past).
Comparing medieval church and modern islam isnt really a realistic comparison.
quote:Originally posted by TheOneNOnly: Tired of people putting down a religion because of a few "bad eggs".
quote:Islam "None of you [truly] believes until he wishes for his brother what he wishes for himself." Number 13 of Imam "Al-Nawawi's Forty Hadiths."
I'm not talking about "terrorism", i'm talking about stuff like womens rights, human rights, freedom of speech et cetera. Stuff we take for granted.
Alert moderatorEdited by - whispering on 2010/01/10 18:32:09
TheOneNOnly Advanced Member
United States
1,937 posts Joined: Oct, 2008
Posted - 2010/01/10 : 18:34:57
And a religion can't evolve as time goes on why?
Oh wait. THEY DO AND HAVE.
What Islam is today doesn't mean what it will be IN THE FUTURE.
You also assume Religion will suddenly take over all Government establishments, and change every law ever created and radically change the entire governmental system already set in place in most of these countries.
There's also the lack of acknowledging the growing rate of people being non-religious in the first place.
Alert moderatorEdited by - TheOneNOnly on 2010/01/10 18:38:56
whispering Moderator
Finland
8,453 posts Joined: Nov, 2002
Posted - 2010/01/10 : 18:46:18
quote:Originally posted by TheOneNOnly:
And a religion can't evolve as time goes on why?
Oh wait. THEY DO AND HAVE.
What Islam is today doesn't mean what it will be IN THE FUTURE.
You also assume Religion will suddenly take over all Government establishments, and change every law ever created and radically change the entire governmental system already set in place in most of these countries.
There's also the lack of acknowledging the growing rate of people being non-religious in the first place.
Off course it can evolve, just as well it can not evolve. Why I believe theres a good chance it will not, is because it has actually taken a U-turn for the worse in many muslim countries. The fact that why i do believe they'll try to change the laws, is because they allready do try. As an example that previous link. What id like to know is do you see it as a scary, uneffecting to your life or a positive possibility?
TheOneNOnly Advanced Member
United States
1,937 posts Joined: Oct, 2008
Posted - 2010/01/10 : 18:53:53
And the point I'm bringing up is:
You can't know for sure.
Everything we might think happen, could be the exact opposite of what might. If everything does change? Then I hope the right people step up and try to "correct" things in terms of freedoms. But, for all we know this might lay the roads for a better society.
The point is we just don't know what this will lead too, and it could be positive, or it could be negative. Everyone in the past thought the same exact things when the Roman Empire fell, the British Empire lost America, the Soviet Union collapsed, etc. All of which lead to something bad, or good, depending who you ask.
I can't honestly think that somewhere in the background someone is making the Muslim population reproduce like they do so in the future they can rise as an army to destroy non-believers. Maybe in some areas, but in everywhere on the globe where the Islamic religion is growing? That's pushing it to the extreme.
If my Children choose to be Muslim, that's their choice. I'm not imprinting religion on my impressionable child when they grow up, I'll let them choose for themselves to follow what they believe when they grow up. It's not my choice to make.
whispering Moderator
Finland
8,453 posts Joined: Nov, 2002
Posted - 2010/01/10 : 19:08:05
quote:Originally posted by TheOneNOnly:
And the point I'm bringing up is:
You can't know for sure.
Everything we might think happen, could be the exact opposite of what might. If everything does change? Then I hope the right people step up and try to "correct" things in terms of freedoms. But, for all we know this might lay the roads for a better society.
The point is we just don't know what this will lead too, and it could be positive, or it could be negative. Everyone in the past thought the same exact things when the Roman Empire fell, the British Empire lost America, the Soviet Union collapsed, etc. All of which lead to something bad, or good, depending who you ask.
I can't honestly think that somewhere in the background someone is making the Muslim population reproduce like they do so in the future they can rise as an army to destroy non-believers. Maybe in some areas, but in everywhere on the globe where the Islamic religion is growing? That's pushing it to the extreme.
If my Children choose to be Muslim, that's their choice. I'm not imprinting religion on my impressionable child when they grow up, I'll let them choose for themselves to follow what they believe when they grow up. It's not my choice to make.
No, i dont know, and few years ago i didnt see it even as realistic. Now, i dont know. Maby its too much news (-> you read more news on violence and believe the world is more violent), but it seems to me, that islam in western countries has changed to hate the western world. Theres news stories of hate speech from imams in various countries. A cartoon spurred up a series of riots, death threats, assassination attempts. Honor killings going up etc. Its not pretty and its not the direction i want my country to go to. Its not about religion anymore per se.
Alert moderatorEdited by - whispering on 2010/01/10 19:09:08
Fishy Advanced Member
Norway
2,521 posts Joined: Apr, 2004
Posted - 2010/01/10 : 20:29:28
quote:Originally posted by whispering:
quote:Originally posted by Fishy:
No, Most Muslims I know is good people
Media dont reflect the truth, its exaggeration.. ye some people are like this, but theres just as bad white people
K, glad you've delt with it better then us. We here however have a 6 times or higher rate on sex crimes (with some ethnities it goes as far as 14 times larger rates) and assaults, when it comes to minorities. Into a degree where even the more peaceful ones (majority i hope) of said demographies are getting worried. (Those are official statistics by the government.)
Edit: seems that its not much different in Norway http://www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article190268.ece Found some other reports where they said 65-70% of rapes in norway and denmark we're by immigrants, then for sweden found too many cases where the victims were underaged that just couldnt continue to read. All in all, i google islam i find A sites which say islam is a religion of peace and B news pieces and statistics that show the complete opposite.
I live in Finland, i ****ing love my country. I dont think were better then everyone else, or anything like that. But i do feel strongly about our small scrap of land in the middle of nowhere and the people that live in it. Our grandfathers and great grandfathers didnt go through 3 wars so we can just throw everything away in the name of "tolerance and understanding". Multiculturalism isnt automatically a good thing, sometimes it seems its a really really bad thing.
Alert moderatorEdited by - whispering on 2010/01/10 22:10:03
8D Advanced Member
Canada
820 posts Joined: Oct, 2009
Printer friendly
Posted - 2010/01/10 : 17:44:55
