NekoShuffle Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,480 posts Joined: Nov, 2009
Posted - 2010/10/14 : 13:20:43
We all may hate to admit it, but Smoogie is actually right on this one. It doesn't apply to all hardcore, or even all genres but we're in a cesspit as far as ideas go.
Not my kinda thing, but what catches my ear is that tune going through it, it's a catchy little riff which is a great thing in music. But where do I recognise it?
Oh look, there we go! It seems that it was produced well in 92, but now we can't think of anything original, so we'll just copy it.
I'm not biased at all here, this is one of my favorite tunes by one of my favorite producers!!
but a quick google of the lyrics reveals the original:
Now, I prefer DJ Stompy's Happy Hardcore version because I think it translates really well from eurodance, in fact I don't have a problem with 'Updating' a few tunes here and there, but when you really look into it, there is SO much hardcore borrows from other genres. DJ Stompy - Body Rock; another great fave of mine with awesome uplifting vocals, however those vocals come from an old 90s techno song by Dream Frequency.
As I said, this wouldn't be a problem but there are a ridiculous number of samples, vox and more that are ripped from jungle or house classics that you begin to wonder how much of hardcore is original. And it's not just hardcore, think how many times Children by Robert Miles has been remixed and updated or has had the piano sampled in other tunes. Think how many modern day ragga and dubstep tunes heavily sample old reggae and dub tracks.
It shouldn't stop you from liking music, but if we really step back and look at the bigger picture here there is a real lack of good unique music that will go down in history. I will leave you with a bit of a quote that changed my outlook on electronic music completely:
0:00 - 3:51 the most important quote is at 3:27 by Marshall Jefferson about hits nowadays. Think about it!
Sam Swift Junior Member
Australia
116 posts Joined: Aug, 2010
Posted - 2010/10/15 : 07:51:59
quote:Originally posted by Wilky:
quote:Originally posted by Sam Swift:
Yeah seems like the kewl thing to do. People think it makes them a hero because they slate clubland. They should be grateful record companies are willing to invest money into the scene. Sure some of the tracks are commercial and not everyones taste. But every hardcore complitation has shit songs.
I couldn't agree more, The way some people bang on is as if the style they listen to has amazing tunes and nothing but... smoogie is bad for this... he dusnt grasp the fact that hardcore sounds a lot better these days and is produced to a higher standard... yes u do get the odd shit tune thrown into the mix but most of it is good...
So true man, UK hardcore productions these days are by far the best they have ever been. Standard is so high these days. Smoogie should take a listen to Recons mix on the latest HTID 3. I think he would be surprised how much hardcore is starting to evolve. So many different influences in the new hardcore.
Oldskool was great... but you can't stay stuck in the past. It's like saying, 'I only like old cars from the 50's and all the new cars in 2010 are rubbish' lol
__________________________________
The West Coast of the Southern Hemisphere
NekoShuffle Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,480 posts Joined: Nov, 2009
Posted - 2010/10/15 : 09:37:09
quote:Originally posted by Sam Swift:
quote:Originally posted by Wilky:
quote:Originally posted by Sam Swift:
Yeah seems like the kewl thing to do. People think it makes them a hero because they slate clubland. They should be grateful record companies are willing to invest money into the scene. Sure some of the tracks are commercial and not everyones taste. But every hardcore complitation has shit songs.
I couldn't agree more, The way some people bang on is as if the style they listen to has amazing tunes and nothing but... smoogie is bad for this... he dusnt grasp the fact that hardcore sounds a lot better these days and is produced to a higher standard... yes u do get the odd shit tune thrown into the mix but most of it is good...
So true man, UK hardcore productions these days are by far the best they have ever been. Standard is so high these days. Smoogie should take a listen to Recons mix on the latest HTID 3. I think he would be surprised how much hardcore is starting to evolve. So many different influences in the new hardcore.
Oldskool was great... but you can't stay stuck in the past. It's like saying, 'I only like old cars from the 50's and all the new cars in 2010 are rubbish' lol
thats not true, and to use your analogy, cars in the 50s were built to last to a high standard. They didn;t have all the bells and whistles of modern vehicles but you still see them driving around today because they are solid, many current car manufacturers of today base their designs upon older cars because the old design principles were spot on.
similar to modern hardcore: yes there is a far greater level of complexity but that does not make it better, it just makes it deeper. You will also find that the better tracks out there nowadays very frequently take samples, vocals and melodies from old skool tunes because back then many tracks were made to a good standard
Music is not a technology, by adding more things to it you do not make it better, you just make it more complex. This whole thing of "music needs to evolve" has been entirely misinterpreted. Thanks to technology adding more layers of complexity it should mean that we utilise them by creating entirely original music but instead we just seem to be relying on the next new production technology to carry the sound and that is completely wrong; and hardcore is certainly not the only culprit for this.
I'll be honest, I'm not actually a big fan of the more breakbeat hardcore from slipmatt and so on, but when it comes down to it the stuff he did is probably about as noteworthy as hardcore gets because he is a good musician. Nothing against the sound nowadays but in 20 years time we are not gonna hear it at old skool nights, we're gonna hear stuff from 96 and earlier.
NekoShuffle Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,480 posts Joined: Nov, 2009
Posted - 2010/10/15 : 09:57:18
And to use a live example we should all be familiar with: Luna-C
Luna-C makes excellent breakbeat hardcore today that you could slip into an old skool set without problems, that's because it doesn't matter if you make hardcore with a massive cubase setup in an expensive studio or if you make it by bloody banging a couple of wooden blocks together at about 175bpm, if it is catchy and good then it's catchy and good, you'll be humming it back on the way back from the club.
I'm 19, I got into hardcore in the year 2004, I've never been to an old plymouth warehouse rave nor do I know the so called golden age of 1996 so I'm definitley not some kind of jaded raver. In fact I forgot about hardcore for a couple of years and came back in 2006 because I liked Save Me by Darren Styles.
I am telling you now, musically, there was a much greater quality of music being made back in the 90s. That's not to say "all 90s hardcore was good and modern hardcore is shit" because believe me I've heard old skool hardcore that has practically bored me to tears but even so.
I hate to say it but modern hardcore really does lack musical talent; the 90s lacked it as well, but there were more high-quality acts back then. The most ironic part is that in my opinion Darren Styles is one of the most talented producers of today and one of the few who are actually trying to bring some quality to the hardcore 'sound of today' and what happens? The rest of the scene writes him off as crap!! Ridiculous.
For the most part though I have to say I don't blame the artists, I blame a lot of promoters out there, becuase it's so difficult to get a booking as a DJ at a noteworthy event if you haven't got your own tracks. Therefore we end up with rushed sounding tracks left right and center and who can blame them really, they're just trying to get their name out there.
Printer friendly
Posted - 2010/10/14 : 13:20:43
