Empyreal New Member
Germany
78 posts Joined: Apr, 2008
Posted - 2012/10/02 : 11:17:02
quote:Originally posted by Josephson_Junction:
Now that I think about it, did Happy Hardcore emerge from Dutch Hardcore?
No, not directly! It's a complicated story. In the early 90's British breakbeat hardcore went into different directions: Drum & Bass/Jungle was one of them, happy hardcore was another one. This early happy hardcore was dominated by breakbeats, pianos and sub basses. Dutch hardcore was really hard 4/4 distorted kick music at that time. I think it was Scott Brown who started mixing the hard Dutch sound with the happy UK sound (Bouncy techno/Happy Gabber). This had an impact on both scenes: The UK producers incorporated hard 4/4 kicks into their happy tunes and some of the Dutch producers incorporated a "happy vibe" to their sound. After some very cheesy chart tunes happy hardcore disappeared from the Dutch scene. The UK scene survived and evolved and slowly became what we call UK hardcore today.
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If you like hardcore with orchestral elements please have a listen:
Samination Advanced Member
Sweden
13,221 posts Joined: Jul, 2004
195 hardcore releases
Posted - 2012/10/02 : 13:01:31
quote:Originally posted by Triquatra:
afaik ishkar has always been dead set against changing any of it - he isn't even into dance music from what I hear..
he doesnt like it, but he also doesnt dislike some of the hardcore stuff :D
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Samination, Swedish Hardcore DJ
Happy, UK Hardcore, Freeform, Makina and Gabber http://samination.se/ ---------------------------------------------
Josephson_Junction Advanced Member
United States
512 posts Joined: Jan, 2012
Posted - 2012/10/02 : 16:55:42
quote:Originally posted by knechtodawas:
quote:Originally posted by Josephson_Junction:
Now that I think about it, did Happy Hardcore emerge from Dutch Hardcore?
No, not directly! It's a complicated story. In the early 90's British breakbeat hardcore went into different directions: Drum & Bass/Jungle was one of them, happy hardcore was another one. This early happy hardcore was dominated by breakbeats, pianos and sub basses. Dutch hardcore was really hard 4/4 distorted kick music at that time. I think it was Scott Brown who started mixing the hard Dutch sound with the happy UK sound (Bouncy techno/Happy Gabber). This had an impact on both scenes: The UK producers incorporated hard 4/4 kicks into their happy tunes and some of the Dutch producers incorporated a "happy vibe" to their sound. After some very cheesy chart tunes happy hardcore disappeared from the Dutch scene. The UK scene survived and evolved and slowly became what we call UK hardcore today.
Thanks for that bit of exposition. Every bit helps. :)
Anyway, here's a flowchart that is probably woefully inaccurate:
What should I add and change?
Alert moderatorEdited by - Josephson_Junction on 2012/10/02 20:18:54
Empyreal New Member
Germany
78 posts Joined: Apr, 2008
Posted - 2012/10/02 : 20:25:03
Looks pretty good. You could add more complexity to the Dutch side if you want (Newstyle, Hardstyle, industrial Hardcore etc.). Will add some further notes tomorrow.
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If you like hardcore with orchestral elements please have a listen:
Breakbeat Jon Average Member
United Kingdom
223 posts Joined: Dec, 2011
Posted - 2012/10/12 : 18:17:21
quote:Originally posted by Dante:
Maybe swap hardcore breaks and breakbeat hardcore
nah, thats the right way round. Breakbeat hardcore was just called hardcore in the early 90s, eventually morphing into 4 beat. Hardcore Breaks has only been round the last 10 years or so, when people needed a name to call the 92 style revival that kicked off.
Warnman Advanced Member
Germany
2,677 posts Joined: Jun, 2010
Posted - 2012/10/12 : 19:40:16
You might want to add Industrial Hardcore/Frenchcore, Terror and Darkcore/Doomcore. I know Revs once mentioned a genre called Tekkno, but I don't know if this is real genre.
The term Gabba has been used quite often in Dutch/German Hardcore music. Gabber usually was used in anglophone countries, so both are pretty much the same.
And I would add a connection between Bouncy Techno / Happy Gabber and Gabber/Gabba as well.
Old Dutch Hardcore/Gabba was called Hardcore Techno as well.
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Ravers unite!
"Happy Hardcore: Love it... hate it... it's fun!" (Matt Stokes)
jenks Advanced Member
United Kingdom
3,698 posts Joined: Feb, 2003
19 hardcore releases
Posted - 2012/10/13 : 10:47:14
quote:Originally posted by Josephson_Junction:
What should I add and change?
I'd say German hardcore and breakbeat hardcore are the genesis of the genre, Dutch gabber came a bit later out of the stuff already going on in Germany.
Hard2Get Advanced Member
United Kingdom
12,837 posts Joined: Jun, 2001
Posted - 2012/10/13 : 11:14:13
quote:Originally posted by jenks:
quote:Originally posted by Josephson_Junction:
What should I add and change?
I'd say German hardcore and breakbeat hardcore are the genesis of the genre, Dutch gabber came a bit later out of the stuff already going on in Germany.
Warnman Advanced Member
Germany
2,677 posts Joined: Jun, 2010
Posted - 2012/10/13 : 18:00:52
quote:Originally posted by Hard2Get:
quote:Originally posted by jenks:
quote:Originally posted by Josephson_Junction:
What should I add and change?
I'd say German hardcore and breakbeat hardcore are the genesis of the genre, Dutch gabber came a bit later out of the stuff already going on in Germany.
How early are you talking?
A friend of mine had been raving in the 90's to Hardcore Techno and he told me the first track was from 1989 by Marc "Acardipane" Trauner.
Mescalinum United - We Have Arrived
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Ravers unite!
"Happy Hardcore: Love it... hate it... it's fun!" (Matt Stokes)
Hard2Get Advanced Member
United Kingdom
12,837 posts Joined: Jun, 2001
Posted - 2012/10/13 : 18:12:10
Ah yes i have heard that before. It's really hard to imagine that such a track could exist in 1989. So far ahead of it's time.
Warnman Advanced Member
Germany
2,677 posts Joined: Jun, 2010
Posted - 2012/10/13 : 19:47:57
quote:Originally posted by Hard2Get:
Ah yes i have heard that before. It's really hard to imagine that such a track could exist in 1989. So far ahead of it's time.
Besides committing a Holocaust, creating great rave music was the only thing we Germans have been able to produce efficiently since the past decades. Too sad that the rave history of this country ended back in 1997 and today the local "rave scene" seems to be only focused to the shit that's coming from across the pond.
But I think the UK roots with the Breakbeat tracks is even older and it's a pity I barely know a thing about it. Whatever: Hardcore is Hardcore!
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Ravers unite!
"Happy Hardcore: Love it... hate it... it's fun!" (Matt Stokes)
Archefluxx Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,120 posts Joined: Sep, 2011
Posted - 2012/10/13 : 23:48:16
Aye, I think Luna-C's book (which I regrettably left at home) said that Breakbeat Hardcore movement in the early 90's was around 160bpm. It gradually sped up. Jungle I think was 172 or 176, UK hardcore typically 170 or 175. Jungle can span into Drum & Bass and 'Breakcore' (which is just psychopathic Germans mass-murdering an amen break to make a politcal message :P ~ Alec Empire ~ I kid)
Josephson_Junction Advanced Member
United States
512 posts Joined: Jan, 2012
Posted - 2012/10/14 : 00:14:38
I'll definitely link together Bouncy Techno / Happy Gabber and Gabber. Also, did Speedcore come before or after Gabber? Plus, where exactly would Hardstyle and Industrial Hardcore / Frenchcore stem from?
quote:Originally posted by Shades:
is this list speed orientated?
Printer friendly
Posted - 2012/10/02 : 11:17:02
