| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Ken Masters |
I thought i'd check this out as i've seen a lot of Ravine vids on youtube & really liked his style & scratching but have never really seen cotts in action. As u all know, i'm not the biggest fan of CDJ's & this vid didn't exactly sway me to the digital side.
I was just wandering if people get the same enjoyment out of seeing a dj pressing loads of buttons & turning loads of knobs just to add these skipping effects as I do out of watching someone on a set of vinyl decks Cutting & Scratching? I know that a lot of people on here are bug fans of CDJ's & respect their decisions but is it just me that finds this video sooooo boring?
Mabey im still stuck in the old ways & can't appreciate the sound of CD decks but when u see someone ruining the production of the track so that they can add these horrible skipping sounds and other effects it just doesn't do it for me.
I was wandering if anyone else feels like this or should I change my name to DJ Down with CDJ's? Let me know if this vid excitied you!
P.S. A plate of food on the record deck! A plate of food?  |
| djbuzz1021 |
just got myself a DJM400 mixer bud, so ill be doing button pressing but cutting and scratching too on the good old black stuff.
|
| Torpex |
quote:
Originally posted by djkenmasters:
P.S. A plate of food on the record deck! A plate of food?
In case you missed it, it was the whole point of the video. |
| Ken Masters |
what, the whole point of the video was to eat food & mix?? I thought it was a video to show us what DJ Cott's can do & what were missing out on? I must have misunderstood it. |
| Torpex |
He's got other vids to show his skills, this one is for pure comedy value. ;) |
| danjel |
I think this vid is really entertaining! :D And Cotts is really good on the CDJs and on the effects.
And yeah, I find it more entertaining looking on this then looking on someone that spins vinyl... And it also sounds much better!
Im tired of all these vinylfreaks that turns down CD-Djs. But Im glad that they are getting less... |
| DarrenJ |
funny :D |
| Ken Masters |
but couldn't anyone do what he's doing? (purely for debate reasons) |
| Torpex |
No, it requires knowledge, proficiency in handling all the controls, good timing and taste for what fits at a given moment. In other words - skill. |
| Ken Masters |
mmmmmmmmmmmmmm |
| mj-dream |
ravines vids on youtube are good :) |
| Jax |
personally i dont like lots of messing on the effects and cdj's. a little bit here and there is ok but it can get ott for me very quickly.
if the track that is being played about with sounds better with all those effects on then lots of produceres would do that sort of thing in the track him/herself
... good to watch but doesnt really enhance the music for me |
| bulby_g |
Personally I find watching other people mix boring full stop. :P Rather just listen or mix myself. Prefer to use vinyl but not really fussed what others use as long as they keep me interested music wise and know how to mix smoothly.
I'm not a big fan of over using effects. Less is more. I don't like it when people scratch all the way through a mix either mind. :-/ |
| kdf |
i think hes pretty sick but i wouldnt like that much effects used in every mix
does anyone know the first track he plays? |
| Leto |
That does indeed require skill. He managed to hold the camera with one hand, mix two tracks and eat some green beans all at once.
That's pretty badass.
First track is S3RL - Artificial Energy, just came out on Executive Digital on hardbeatstore.com. |
| TypeR |
quote:
Originally posted by djkenmasters:
but couldn't anyone do what he's doing? (purely for debate reasons)
um no.
you don't just press play and magic occurs and you are a superstar. they are precise instruments and it would be a waste of any djs skills to not embrace them.
if you are the wizard of technics, imagine how good you will be once you learn how to use cdj1000s.
seriously.
you have to pretty much learn how to dj all over again using them, minus the beatmatching part. that is if you can figure out how to phase them to each other.
they are difficult to learn, but the outcome is truely positive.
watching someone play on them is about as entertaining as watching someone move a black circle back and forth while moving a half inch square over a groove that is four inches long on the side of a turntable. lol.
watching someone mix is boring unless that person is actually doing something other than just standing there lol.
but anyway, once you have your beats matched and they are in time you could hold the same mix with a loop function for hours. try that with turntables. |
| Jimouk |
People who turn down CD mixing because they want to stay "oldskool" are pretty stupid if you ask me. To much new music is released via the internet on MP3 format these days instead of vinyl its ridiculous. I don't understand how people expect to get there tracklists up to date without making the switch to CDJs, or if they spend hundreads on something like Serato.
I switched a few years back and I have never looked back since, I keep the vinyl turntables for exclusive vinyl tracks but other then that they just collect dust. |
| silver |
Each to their own, it's about the music at the end of the day not the equipment. |
| Dain-Ja |
umm... you can cut and scratch on CDJs too
So really, you're asking whether people like it better when DJs cut and scratch or when they use effects?
I have a DJM800 and the effects definitely require skill to master. I can do what Cotts does but it a few weeks to learn.
Like anything - I guess ANYBODY could do it, but ANYBODY could also scratch or mix on vinyl.
I mix on both CDJs and vinyl and I find vinyl easier (mostly cause my CDJs suck). The only thing that really makes mixing on CDJs alot easier is that alot of people produce tracks at the same BPM so you often don't have to beatmatch (but this also applies to vinyl to a certain extent)...and beatmatching is the easiest part of DJing anyways |
| Cotts |
Hmm interesting topic, it takes it back to the old CDJ vs Vinyl arguement again.
DJKenMasters, the video was purely just for a little bit of a laugh, I don't normally put food on the decks!, it was just all a bit of fun not really to actually have a serious mix.
At the end of the day both formats a different, as DJ Tutor always says:
Real DJ's play CDS, Real DJ's Play Vinyl, Real DJ's Play Music
It dosent matter what format you spin, it's if you enjoy it or not. Without a doubt though everything is naturally moving more digital which opens up a lot more possibilities.
Also in that video I did use the effects a little more than I would have normally, whats the fun if I just stand there and let a track play out? |
| Ken Masters |
no mate, I know It was a bit of fun but I just thought it was a shame to see the Record decks getting used for nothing more that a table, that turns lol
Yeah, I agree that it's what u play that makes a DJ but I'm just a total vinyl freak & hate anything digital. I think it's shaping our music around CDJ's & that's where we'll have a problem.
I really just wanted to start this topic up to see if people, like myself, struggle to appreciate CDJ's in use. |
| Analog Dreams |
quote:
Originally posted by Cotts:
Real DJ's play CDS, Real DJ's Play Vinyl, Real DJ's Play Music
That is true, but then again, what about laptop djs? Say you have a vinyl dj come on with just turntables and a mixer, no serato or anything, then a laptop dj comes on with just a laptop. Who is more skilled? Obviously the turntable dj. He just has to do more. He has to beatmatch by ear, then mix it in and make sure the beats don't slip, while playing around with the eq's making sure it is a smooth transition etc, while the other dude just clicks his mouse a few times while browsing his myspace and it's all mixed perfectly . Sure the music is the most important aspect of it, but when people say it's ALL about the music and nothing more, I disagree. It's not just about the music, it's also about how its played. Maybe the crowd does not know or care who is the better dj, but the djs know whats going on.
I mix with vinyl and I don't think I will be using a cdj or laptop anytime soon, and even if I did upgrade, I'd continue to use records with the laptop. It all comes down to preferance, but it's simply not fair if the more skilled dj loses out on a gig because some microwave dj laptop dude took his gig... |
| TypeR |
I can honestly say that i've never heard of anyone being replaced by a laptop dj. laptop djs sound like a fierce bag of shit in my opinion, and i'm sure that if you're losing gigs to a fierce bag of shit, then either you need to call him on it publicly or you need to check your skills.
otherwise i'd need proof that this has happened with names and events. other than that i'm not buying it.
i used to be all about carrying around 80lbs of vinyl every weekend.
not so much anymore. |
| Cotts |
quote:
Originally posted by Analog Dreams:
quote:
Originally posted by Cotts:
Real DJ's play CDS, Real DJ's Play Vinyl, Real DJ's Play Music
That is true, but then again, what about laptop djs? Say you have a vinyl dj come on with just turntables and a mixer, no serato or anything, then a laptop dj comes on with just a laptop. Who is more skilled? Obviously the turntable dj. He just has to do more. He has to beatmatch by ear, then mix it in and make sure the beats don't slip, while playing around with the eq's making sure it is a smooth transition etc, while the other dude just clicks his mouse a few times while browsing his myspace and it's all mixed perfectly . Sure the music is the most important aspect of it, but when people say it's ALL about the music and nothing more, I disagree. It's not just about the music, it's also about how its played. Maybe the crowd does not know or care who is the better dj, but the djs know whats going on.
I mix with vinyl and I don't think I will be using a cdj or laptop anytime soon, and even if I did upgrade, I'd continue to use records with the laptop. It all comes down to preferance, but it's simply not fair if the more skilled dj loses out on a gig because some microwave dj laptop dude took his gig...
Ok you took my point a little too literally there, I dont like laptop dj's myself and I dont think its a format that people should use (apart from learning the basics of DJing).
You are right though, it does come down to preference, but im not talking about laptops here.
I think CDJ's are easier to mix with but they let you push your mix a lot further by opening up a lot of possibilities, its not that someone that uses CDJ's does not have skill, becuase it does still take as with vinyl skill to mix.
|
| Leto |
Lol. Richie Hawtin is laptop DJ. He just uses a gigantic Allen & Heath MIDI controller.
Essentially, if you do let the software automate for you (which a lot of laptop DJs don't do) then you should be doing something else with that freedom.
Thinking outside the box is critical. It opens up the world of DJ'ing to things beyond just standard beatmatching. |
| DJ_FunDaBounce |
quote:
Originally posted by BobbyRitalin:
i used to be all about carrying around 80lbs of vinyl every weekend.
lol! can't say it was a routine for me but whenever I got to play out it was torture carrying my box o' records around.definetly a point for cd's in this respect.
now I carry a little bit of both. |
| TypeR |
quote:
Originally posted by DJ_FunDaBounce:
quote:
Originally posted by BobbyRitalin:
i used to be all about carrying around 80lbs of vinyl every weekend.
lol! can't say it was a routine for me but whenever I got to play out it was torture carrying my box o' records around.definetly a point for cd's in this respect.
now I carry a little bit of both.
same here
|
| Ph33rViper |
Well i will say this:
Using Vinyl does take time to master and so everyone should take the effort to use it and master it.
I do have CDJ1000MK3's and bloody hell they are too easy to mix on. Vinyl aint the same :P
If I see a vinyl DJ play and that person was good, then I would know he had the skill
But with a CDJ, I woudnt know that DJ would have the proper skill to master beatmatching.
CDJ's allow you to concentrate more on your mixing and play with effects and crap more.
Vinyl should still be around. I dont like when people say MP3's are better than vinyl.
Vinyl will always be KING unless someone stuffs up the pressing / mastering process :P
Of course you will get Vinyl that sounds dodgy and the reason is my point above.
Digital is a very good technology to have but Vinyl kills it. I have HHC010 on a Vinyl and CD.
Guess what is better??? The Vinyl. Vinyl DOES have a deeper / warmer sound to it.
I dont care what format you use at the end of the day. Its just you want to have the skill to beatmatch, mix and adjust volume.
I find DJ's that use Vinyl are more skilled :)
Long Live the 12" Wax :D
EDIT: Where is the value of buying MP3's? They are worth Nothing after you buy them unfortunetly
If you dont want the tune anymore on vinyl at least you can sell it :D |
| whispering |
quote:
Originally posted by Cotts:
Ok you took my point a little too literally there, I dont like laptop dj's myself and I dont think its a format that people should use (apart from learning the basics of DJing).
You are right though, it does come down to preference, but im not talking about laptops here.
I think CDJ's are easier to mix with but they let you push your mix a lot further by opening up a lot of possibilities, its not that someone that uses CDJ's does not have skill, becuase it does still take as with vinyl skill to mix.
Why does it make a diffrence if the music comes from a Compact disc or a Hard discdrive? |
| acidfluxxbass |
quote:
I thought i'd check this out as i've seen a lot of Ravine vids on youtube & really liked his style & scratching but have never really seen cotts in action
i saw cotts vinyl limited edition mix first. then more of his and then ravine.
the limited edition mix is no longer on youtube but feature gammer re-sauce vip which is why i love it as ken masters will know XD
also, big up to the singstar microphone.
also also, ravine has moves! the secret vid waaay outclassed his hardstyle dancing one XD |
| Ken Masters |
@ Ph33rViper: "Where is the value of buying MP3's? They are worth Nothing after you buy them unfortunetly"
"If you dont want the tune anymore on vinyl at least you can sell it :D"
That is a great point mate! I've never even thought of that. Once you buy your MP3's, that's you. Theres no selling them on. |
| Torpex |
It's hardly a point against mp3s as a music source for DJs. Not all DJs are collectors, I wouldn't consider myself one. |
| acidfluxxbass |
mp3's are prone to being corrupted or lost through errors and whatnot. vinyl collects dust which is a vivid fashion and personality statement. |
| Analog Dreams |
I don't know I guess I'll always be a vinyl purist. It's not that I don't respect dj's who use cdjs. I mean tracklist and the way you mix the tracks is by far the most important part of mixing, and if a dj picks the best tunes and mixes them well, he is doing his job. But aside from how it sounds, it's also a feeling. When you go to a rave, and you know the guy has no serato or cdjs to aid his beatmatching, you know he COULD **** up, and that makes it more exciting does it not? When he pulls of a tight mix you're like wow!
|
| TypeR |
ask any of the top djs playing in the hardcore scene when the last time they used vinyl for anything other than scratching. |
| Ken Masters |
i'd like to think that a lot of the big names still go back to Vinly for a mix or two now and again. After all, this is what they grew up with. |
| Jimouk |
quote:
Originally posted by acidfluxxbass:
mp3's are prone to being corrupted or lost through errors and whatnot. vinyl collects dust which is a vivid fashion and personality statement.
Thats why you back them up...
And who cares if you can't sell them on? If I buy a track I never intend on selling it on... x_x |
| TypeR |
quote:
Originally posted by djkenmasters:
i'd like to think that a lot of the big names still go back to Vinly for a mix or two now and again. After all, this is what they grew up with.
they don't. if they did they'd just be playing burnt out dub plates that sound like poo. |
| bulby_g |
quote:
Originally posted by BobbyRitalin:
quote:
Originally posted by djkenmasters:
i'd like to think that a lot of the big names still go back to Vinly for a mix or two now and again. After all, this is what they grew up with.
they don't. if they did they'd just be playing burnt out dub plates that sound like poo.
I'm sure at least some of them have all their back cat' on proper vinyl... Some of them will have vinyl collections even if they don't use them anymore. |
| Showstopper |
quote:
Originally posted by BobbyRitalin:
quote:
Originally posted by djkenmasters:
i'd like to think that a lot of the big names still go back to Vinly for a mix or two now and again. After all, this is what they grew up with.
they don't. if they did they'd just be playing burnt out dub plates that sound like poo.
Wrong. In Scott Brown's DVD you can see him using vinyl in one of his sets.
|
| Ken Masters |
I saw Scott Brown playing a vinyl set at the Hardcore Heaven Weekender in 07! lol
To think that these guy's have stopped using vinyl altogether is laughable! Ok, they might not promote it as much seeing as everyone thinks CD decks are the future but if u think that all these guy's use is CD's, u should think again! |
| Analog Dreams |
I'm pretty sure seduction uses vinyl too doesn't he? In some of his hardcore adrenaline sets you can hear him pushing the record forward to keep beatmatched... |
| bulby_g |
quote:
Originally posted by Analog Dreams:
I'm pretty sure seduction uses vinyl too doesn't he? In some of his hardcore adrenaline sets you can hear him pushing the record forward to keep beatmatched...
Sounds the same on a CD-J or Serato etc. Still... Surprised someone is actually mixing on a commercial CD and not just doing it in some program on a computer!? |
| TypeR |
quote:
Originally posted by Showstopper:
quote:
Originally posted by BobbyRitalin:
quote:
Originally posted by djkenmasters:
i'd like to think that a lot of the big names still go back to Vinly for a mix or two now and again. After all, this is what they grew up with.
they don't. if they did they'd just be playing burnt out dub plates that sound like poo.
Wrong. In Scott Brown's DVD you can see him using vinyl in one of his sets.
over in the U.S. we don't see them play vinyl because they would have to obtain a work visa to bring them into the country. In the UK they can play vinyl all day long because they live there. If they bring it here, they'd be either deported or would have to simply leave it at the airport.
|
| TypeR |
quote:
Originally posted by djkenmasters:
I saw Scott Brown playing a vinyl set at the Hardcore Heaven Weekender in 07! lol
To think that these guy's have stopped using vinyl altogether is laughable! Ok, they might not promote it as much seeing as everyone thinks CD decks are the future but if u think that all these guy's use is CD's, u should think again!
cost to press a single vinyl versus burning it onto a cd to play right now.
you do the math djkenmasters, you may think it's laughable and that it's "the future" it's just the way it is man.
|
| Ph33rViper |
quote:
Originally posted by BobbyRitalin:
quote:
Originally posted by djkenmasters:
I saw Scott Brown playing a vinyl set at the Hardcore Heaven Weekender in 07! lol
To think that these guy's have stopped using vinyl altogether is laughable! Ok, they might not promote it as much seeing as everyone thinks CD decks are the future but if u think that all these guy's use is CD's, u should think again!
cost to press a single vinyl versus burning it onto a cd to play right now.
you do the math djkenmasters, you may think it's laughable and that it's "the future" it's just the way it is man.
That may be BUT Vinyls are still going strong.
When Amato went bust you woudnt believe the number of vinyls that were lost / being pressed at the time :P
Have a guess :)
Try 10000 Vinyl Records + (would love a confirmation) XD
|
| Ken Masters |
A warehouse full of 10,000 Vinyl! That sounds like heaven to me!  all you need is a set of Technics 1210's, a mixer & a sound system & you've got one hell of a long party!
I wonder what happened to it all? |
| DJ_FunDaBounce |
quote:
Originally posted by djkenmasters:
A warehouse full of 10,000 Vinyl! That sounds like heaven to me! all you need is a set of Technics 1210's, a mixer & a sound system & you've got one hell of a long party!
probably 100 copies of 100 different records.If thats' the case I've got more than that in my collection. |
| TypeR |
geeeeeeeeee thanks, i needed that.
like i didn't know that.
also, it didn't have anything to do with the pro's using vinyl or not bringing it into the state.
|
| Cotts |
At the end of the day guys people are going to be divided on this one.
It takes skill to mix both formats regardless of what you are playing.
One is not better, one is not worse. They have advantages and disadvantages.
I prefer digital and thats just my opinion. |
| Cotts |
also DJ KenMasters you say you really liked DJ Ravines vids? but in all his vids he uses Serato so esentially its digital at the end of the day? He dosent play actual vinyl |
| acidfluxxbass |
quote:
Originally posted by Cotts:
At the end of the day guys people are going to be divided on this one.
It takes skill to mix both formats regardless of what you are playing.
One is not better, one is not worse. They have advantages and disadvantages.
I prefer digital and thats just my opinion.
either way your mixes are awesome so i dont see why anyone would have anything against that which comes back to the Real DJ's Play Music idea.
i couldnt give a flying sawney_bean how you played your tunes so if you use CDJ, Serato Or Vinyl im happy.
I want to get into it (DJing) so I think I'll start with vinyl |
| TypeR |
when listening to a mix, no one on the planet would be able to tell how you made it unless you told them |
