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yaddam205
Advanced Member
United States
1,219 posts
Joined: Dec, 2004
53 hardcore releases
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 Posted - 2005/07/14 : 05:38:39
quote:
Originally posted by Comet:
My view is not about the artists selling out. They can do whatever they want or plan to do. My view is on how america will treat it like anything else that's come here.
I used to love trance. In '01/'02, it started to become popular here. I went to hardcore. While I'm persuing hardcore, trance has become really well known here. Anything that becomes mainstream here automatically turns to shit. There is nothing in my mind that has improved once becoming mainstream here in USA.
Is hardcore becomes mainstream in america, you will get so much shit. Like people who are wannabe DJs (say they are but not even can mix), etc. I can't really think off the top of my head, but if it becomes popular here, it will become a fad. It will die off and then worsen it's status.
I think the place where it's at right now is perfect. Popular in UK is fine because they don't make much of a big deal about it. Here, people become obsessed, and when it's over, they'll just leave. It'll be used, essentially.
Of course, you will say, "But you're thinking of all the negatives. Think of the positives!". I did. I weighed them both out and the negatives totally smash over the positives. I know there are some that will agree with me. But as I'm posting this on Hhc.com forums, there will be a big lashback towards me and my opinion of people trying to persuade me otherwise.
yaddam205: You're post and how it was worded totally made me lose respect for your opinion. Also, calling people names will start flaming.
OK i agree with SOME of what your saying but first off "When has trance become popular?" just think there has only about 3 or 4 songs that hit the mainstream and actually went big in the past 5 years (Darude, Fat Boyslim, The Prodigy, Daft Punk,) And i still hear alot of those songs today, but no new ones. the fact is the American mainstram is very hard to crack with something new like trance i mean hell, whenever an american hears any form of eletronica all they say is "nice techno" TECHNO for crying out loud. And when did trace "lose its artistic integrity" HMMMM... oh wait it didnt.
Think before you sepak
(im gonna get flammed for that later on i can feel it)
It's Hardcore or BUST!
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Mortis
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
7,493 posts
Joined: May, 2004
341 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 05:40:36
quote:
Originally posted by Comet:
I used to love trance. In '01/'02, it started to become popular here. I went to hardcore. While I'm persuing hardcore, trance has become really well known here. Anything that becomes mainstream here automatically turns to shit.
It seems that everyone, regardless of their music taste, hates it when it becomes popular. Why can't we just enjoy the fact that the music we love so much is being listened to by more people...?
The way we sound sometimes, we might just aswell be emo kids.
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I think you ought to know, I think i've lost control.
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"Maybe in a day and age in which even our rappers can't get to the end of a verse without having an existential crisis, we should find a place for happy hardcore"
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Brian K
Advanced Member
United States
8,663 posts
Joined: Sep, 2001
528 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 05:44:04
hardcore I feel is different from most electronic music. it's usually fast based and frantic, not easy listening like most trance.
I really don't think hardcore would ever become commercial as it's too fast for the majority. dnb is getting put in video games and radio/tv ads and I don't here kids playing it in their cars or talking about a new deiselboy release (minus my friends =P)
most children these days are spoon fed top 40 nonsense and call most electronic music crap, even though most of the songs they listen to are produced on the same instruments as electronic music.
most of the people I've talked to over in the UK have told me that as soon as something starts to become popular most people stop doing/listening to it. and that it's done worse than it is here.
but atleast we're not the hip hop scene =P
"we'll delete the weak"
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"we'll delete the weak"
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Edited by - Brian K on 2005/07/14 05:45:14 |
Mortis
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
7,493 posts
Joined: May, 2004
341 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 05:53:11
quote:
Originally posted by yaddam205:
there has only about 3 or 4 songs that hit the mainstream and actually went big in the past 5 years (Darude, Fat Boyslim, The Prodigy, Daft Punk)
None of which are trance.
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I think you ought to know, I think i've lost control.
__________________________________
"Maybe in a day and age in which even our rappers can't get to the end of a verse without having an existential crisis, we should find a place for happy hardcore"
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yaddam205
Advanced Member
United States
1,219 posts
Joined: Dec, 2004
53 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 05:58:01
quote:
Originally posted by Mortis:
quote:
Originally posted by yaddam205:
there has only about 3 or 4 songs that hit the mainstream and actually went big in the past 5 years (Darude, Fat Boyslim, The Prodigy, Daft Punk)
None of which are trance.
Lol excalty my point the american public does not or cant tell the diffrence all they see is "techno" not trance or DnB or hardcore just One Genre
It's Hardcore or BUST!
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yaddam205
Advanced Member
United States
1,219 posts
Joined: Dec, 2004
53 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 06:02:54
OH and PS all i wanted was a small counter strike server with HHC radio not a flame war
It's Hardcore or BUST!
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Rita
Average Member
United States
207 posts
Joined: Dec, 2003
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 06:03:24
A lot of you don't live in America, but living in the heart of L.A. and being around rich, Beverly Hills teens, as well as East L.A. minorities, I see how things are treated.
In L.A., when something even has a hint of being popular, no chances are taken. Boom-- it's printed. I have visited Hot Topic one week-- the very next week the entire stock is replaced.
In America, bands are businessmen first, artists second. Hardcore will be twisted and turned-- from Hilary Duff to 50 Cent-- it will appear everywhere and be applied to everything. If it seems like a good idea, it will be milked for all it's worth. I dread hardcore reaching mainstream. I have nightmares of it getting to a point where it's played in Target while you're shopping.
Hardcore will lose value as music, and become nothing but <b>labels and sound</b>.
My mother feels the same way about the band Green Day. She's listened to them since they first began in the 80's. When they changed their record label (because they sold out too fast on the prior label capacity), all of the punks turned against them, calling them sellouts.
I want our DJs to be successful. But success is something completely different in the US, especially L.A., than it may be anywhere else.
Ecuador and Sandstorm are played while waiting in line at Magic Mountain. It's not music. It's muzak. It's sound. It's a joke. People wave their arms around performing air-poi (think air-guitar) before they get on Riddler's Revenge.
If hardcore reaches America as mainstream, it will not be music. It will be a product.
As for the CS idea, you'll get plenty of annoyed responses. I know-- I play a lot of online games where, the whole time, they play rap. And they don't stop. So I leave the game. Post it as a shout or something-- "Hey, pretty good song on (happyhardcore.com radio URL)." If they want to share it's beauty, they will click the link.
I'm so sick of these topics... To quote the children's anime Cosmic Baton Girl Comet-san:
"If something important were to become numerous, it would lose its value." Instead of promoting to just ANYBODY, try promoting to those already interested in the electronic sound, instead of pop preps or metal heads.
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Comet
Advanced Member
United States
1,544 posts
Joined: Aug, 2002
745 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 06:12:44
Most of what I hate about anything becoming a fad or mainstream is how many people here automatically think they become the "master" of it. These people just are so ignorant and think they know everything about that. Yet, there are people who have been in it and with it enough where they HONESTLY know a lot about it.
I also forgot to mention about the production side of commercialism. I have heard with my ears how artists I've liked have worsened thier production style. I used to love so many artists, but ever since they've become mainstream and popular, they don't have that.. core essense I once loved about their stuff. Ferry Corsten was one of them. Then he did It's Time. What the hell? That's not the Ferry I remembered playing epic trance and good tunes at that. I'm saying in my opinion and what I've heard, it has made me drive away from the artists I once loved because of how they suddenly lost that essense that intrigued me.
Yaddam205: I like how you say the thing about losing artistic integrity like it's a fact unlike how I basically stated my post as an opinion. Look above for my reply about artist integrity and what I've experienced it to be.
Rygor: You start off by telling me that my opinion is wrong. Facts can be proven wrong, opinion are what people view things to be from their experience.
1) They put a rave act in because of how people abuse drugs at raves. I have been to maybe 10 raves and at every single one of them, more than one person was doing drugs of some sort. Most of these kids are under 18 as well. You blame the government, I blame the idiots who give raves a bad name; the drug abusers.
2) By big deal I meant the people, not advertising CDs. People there don't FLOCK to hardcore like girls to boy bands. At raves, yeah. But it's not as bad.
3) Again, my opinion about artist integrity is in this post.
What bothers me most about your post is how you begin it that my opinion is wrong and basically means nothing. You have never lived here (as far as I know) and therefore, you are not around the people that live here. You can post your opinion, but I think you really can't say how it REALLY IS here when you live in Australia and only hear about what happens here. It's a big difference from actually living with it.
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ryg0r
Advanced Member
Australia
2,807 posts
Joined: Aug, 2002
34 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 06:55:21
Where to begin.....
There is so much material, but I fear that I'll get caught by my boss for posting at work.
Yes, I do know how the American Popular culture works. If something smells of profit, it will be marketed till it has nothing left. Yes? More on that later....
Raves are all about drugs, and the effect that the music has on peoples minds who are on drugs. The Rave act is so ambigious that any person carrying rave related paraphenalia can get you fined. Its not the drug use, its the lack of thinking from the US goverment.
However, raves are inseperable from drugs. Check this out:
US - tight drug laws, small rave scene.
Holland - sweet fa drug laws, massive, simply huge rave scene.
Very simplistic, but the fact is, that a lot party goers are recreational drug users.
Find me a 100% drug free rave, and I'll show you 10 bigger ones that have lots of use.
Do I agree with the drug use? No, but thats my choice. No-one forces you to take anything.
quote:
By big deal I meant the people, not advertising CDs. People there don't FLOCK to hardcore like girls to boy bands. At raves, yeah. But it's not as bad.
I take it you've not read on ush about djmole stalking Scott Brown? Or been to a rave over 5000 people? 2 saturdays ago, I went to a massive rave, where they only played hardcore. And they had plenty of punters. Thats a big deal I gather. You should have seen how many people went to see Brisk play.
As for the quality of production, thats not commercialism's fault, thats the artists fault. Not anyone elses.
And dont give me this, my opinion your opinion crap. What your saying is that is hardcore became big is the US, the scene would be crap too. Thats not an opinion. Your opinion is - "I dont think its good if it goes mainstream because....(insert farty ass reason here)"
Who cares if they play Sash while your at the shopping center? Who cares if you hear Ferry Corsten while in the queue at the post office? Do they? Of course, they get paid. Does it change the fact it is/was a good song? No. And this is where choice and opinions come into it. You choose what you listen to. If you dont like the future work of another artist, then dont listen to it and find new talent elsewhere.
quote:
These people just are so ignorant and think they know everything about that. Yet, there are people who have been in it and with it enough where they HONESTLY know a lot about it.
Welcome to the real world sunshine. Life is like that. You sound more and more like a sad elitist.
Wait, I have a suggestion.
How about you approach your favourite artist and offer to pay him, just to make music for you?
It seems ridiculous doesnt it. But thats what you sound like. "I want to keep this goodness all to myself. Godforbid that the mass-media spread it because I will have to look for something else because they kill everything."
Stupid.
quote:
In America, bands are businessmen first, artists second.
HAHAHA, you dont even know you're own country. Bands are victims. The managers are the businessmen. The bands more often than not, do not have control over where their music goes or is played. They sign extremely restricting contracts, under the impression that "they will be made" big. The publishers and the manager are the ones that milk the crap out of them. The bands are ignorant.
quote:
Instead of promoting to just ANYBODY, try promoting to those already interested in the electronic sound, instead of pop preps or metal heads.
You dont seem to know much about marketing to you. You have to find the market that you are going to get the best response from (IE electronic music to the electronic market :P) and go from there.
Obviously any artist OR manager is not going to waste their time appealing to a market that isnt open to them.
Comet, the more I read your post, the more selfish I see you've become. Its not all about you man. Its about the music. And the more exposure the artists and the music gets, the better for it. If suddenly you dont like the new stuff any more, you have 3 choices -
1. move on and find stuff you like (which requires time and effort - oh no)
2. Stay listening to the stuff that you like
3. Become and artist and make the stuff that you like.
In any case, if it IS about artist intergrity, you'd understand too, that sometimes you have to appeal to the masses, to get support for the not-so popular stuff. Sometimes underground artists strike it lucky and dont need to because their style is the popular. But for most, its a life of hard work, low pay and lots of tears.
For me as an artist, I constantly question my sound, am I too "mainstream" or am I to abstract and at the end of the day I realise, that any building requires the same thing, despite its architech or engineer. A solid foundation. From there, after having that, they can do what ever they want.
If an artist had no fans, did they ever exist?
I have to get back to work so I'll leave it at that.
For clips, remixes and information about my releases visit:
http://www.commandobot.com
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Comet
Advanced Member
United States
1,544 posts
Joined: Aug, 2002
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 07:40:42
You know, there's nothing I hate more than when I give my view on something and then I get attacked personally for it. I'm done with this.
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Sean Apollo
Advanced Member
United States
1,687 posts
Joined: Jul, 2003
143 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 07:58:14
And there is nothing I hate more then when people take things to seriously and are over dramatic.
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http://apollo.hardcoreforya.net
http://www.happyhardcore.com
North American Hardcore Movement
Addictive Vinyl
Empyre Records
[email protected]
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- Sean Apollo
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Edited by - Sean Apollo on 2005/07/14 07:58:38 |
ryg0r
Advanced Member
Australia
2,807 posts
Joined: Aug, 2002
34 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 08:03:18
And theres nothing more that I hate than a sissie.
:P
For clips, remixes and information about my releases visit:
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Triquatra
Moderator
United Kingdom
12,637 posts
Joined: Nov, 2003
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 08:22:42
christ, do i have to he-bitch-man-slap all of you or what?
COME ON!
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Sean Apollo
Advanced Member
United States
1,687 posts
Joined: Jul, 2003
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 08:24:15
*Calls for group hug*
---------------------------------------
- Sean Apollo
http://apollo.hardcoreforya.net
http://www.happyhardcore.com
North American Hardcore Movement
Addictive Vinyl
Empyre Records
[email protected]
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- Sean Apollo
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ryg0r
Advanced Member
Australia
2,807 posts
Joined: Aug, 2002
34 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2005/07/14 : 08:27:08
*hangs head in shame*
Yeah, I think we all need some hugs.
*stares are the ground*
For clips, remixes and information about my releases visit:
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