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jordesuvi
Junior Member
United Kingdom
113 posts
Joined: Feb, 2014
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 Posted - 2017/02/17 : 08:45:48
quote:
Originally posted by Vladel:
quote:
Originally posted by Triquatra:
well, I'm convinced, 2017 is hardcores' year for sure.
Not the way it's going. I've been through trackitdown & Juno, it's just a total pile of shit this year so far.
You're looking in the wrong places.
Most of the gems I find are usually on SoundCloud and YouTube
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CDJay
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
2,251 posts
Joined: Nov, 2001
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Posted - 2017/02/17 : 10:28:26
I get the cynicism. I really do.
Few things to bear in mind:
- Q1 is, and nearly always has been, release light. Think back to AATW / Ministry release times. Look at when we've put projects out over the past 3 years.
- Whilst I'd be wary of calling 2017 "Hardcore's Year" (I think this is quite 2001-2002 -ey, personally) it's very different to 2015. There have been two massively well attended parties in the UK at the tail end of 2016, and even the January event was busier than the bulk of events in 2015. There's an actual influx UK side of both re-engaged and new followers.
- The HH album was essentially a proof of concept, which worked better than expected. We'd targeted a 3 month sell through on physical. We were caught out in terms of subsequent digital rollout. Our next projects will build on this. We're hoping for 1500-2000 in the medium term, and I believe 5000 is feasible with the right brand/project/release timeline.
- Using our model/platform, per track earnings on 2000 units are directly comparable to tens of thousands of units through traditional distro/vendor models. It sounds soulless, but the reality is that demonstrating that makes it far easier to license material *particularly* using the mix+singles model that I think is now going to become standard.
I totally agree with the idea that singles should also have general public friendly "edits" and indeed that is what will happen as the HH album hits other sites. For fetishists, the HU site will offer both.
We'll be rolling out some re-mastered back cat and albums to streaming vendors, but its definitely not a priority. You'd need 4 *million* plays on Spotify to match the revenue generated by the HH album as a physical release.
Gammer + Styles are doing a U.S tour imminently, and we're working on an international tour of our own for Q3. Sad to say that perception remains as, if not more, important than anything else so the more high profile things even peripherally related to the genre the better.
I think the UK scene will be doubled in terms of ravers and potentially listeners, over the next year. The sky is the limit, on the international side. I've been saying for years that making things slightly less UK dependant is necessary for the genre to thrive again and it seems that some actual effort might now be expended on that. It's also fair to say that "media" will be prioritised and hopefully done to a higher standard than ever before. This is crucial for engagement of potential new generations.
CDJay
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Http://www.hardcoreunderground.co.uk
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Triquatra
Moderator
United Kingdom
12,088 posts
Joined: Nov, 2003
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Posted - 2017/02/17 : 11:00:07
quote:
Originally posted by jordesuvi:
quote:
Originally posted by Vladel:
quote:
Originally posted by Triquatra:
well, I'm convinced, 2017 is hardcores' year for sure.
Not the way it's going. I've been through trackitdown & Juno, it's just a total pile of shit this year so far.
You're looking in the wrong places.
Most of the gems I find are usually on SoundCloud and YouTube
Apparently I wasn't sarcastic enough.
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Forthcoming Tracks!
http://www.hardcoreunderground.co.uk/ - http://CLSM.net - FB/SC
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Captain Triceps
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,300 posts
Joined: Dec, 2011
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Posted - 2017/02/17 : 11:18:18
quote:
Originally posted by CDJay:
(I think this is quite 2001-2002 -ey, personally)
Wow, I remember the buzz and excitement of that time like it was yesterday - it was literally almost half my life ago.
I remember thinking it was all over when events were scrapping hardcore and there was next to nothing being released, I was buying tape packs and hearing all the same tunes repeatedly, then suddenly - boom! UK hardcore was born!
__________________________________
Some of my remixes, original tracks and mixes here:
https://soundcloud.com/bradders-tracks-and-remix
https://soundcloud.com/bradders1982
https://soundcloud.com/paulbradley1982
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CDJay
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
2,251 posts
Joined: Nov, 2001
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Posted - 2017/02/17 : 11:28:30
The potential is certainly there for the same thing to play out. There's a baked in disadvantage, unfortunately, this time around and that is everyone rowing in different directions. Lack of scene unity and common intent are the barriers to growth, not things like accessibility (people really aren't half as scared by the music as is oft presumed).
We'll still be here if and when others decide to engage.
CDJay
__________________________________
Http://www.hardcoreunderground.co.uk
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djDMS
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
9,325 posts
Joined: Feb, 2003
572 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2017/02/17 : 13:00:28
As strange as it may sound, I think there's too much going on.
Too many artists, too many events, too many little groups within groups - most of which don't or won't work together.
There isnt a shortage of talent and dedicated individuals, but there is a massive surplus of hangers-on and self proclaimed big boys who really wouldn't be missed.
I, for one wouldn't be at all bothered by the 'scene' becoming much smaller and more focused before it tries to grow again.
Big branches on a small tree, or small branches on a big tree - which would you rather be?
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Taking my time to perfect the beat
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DJ A.K.
Junior Member
United Kingdom
107 posts
Joined: Dec, 2011
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Posted - 2017/02/17 : 14:20:37
quote:
Originally posted by Hard2Get:
Hardcore is not palatable to the general public. Too 'extreme'. In England and US etc, that is.
Exactly, its too fast and hard (even the soft stuff) and if you tone it down to be more commercial, people rightly say its not hardcore. Its catch 22.
I do think there has been a trend for faster tracks in the dance scene in general (around 150bpm for some hardstyle and future house), so maybe hardcore at 170bpm wont seem as extreme now and get played more.
Hardcores main problem is we need a new big crossover artist, but there isnt enough talent coming through and when they do the politics of "the scene" usually puts them off or forces them to try their luck in another genre.
Finally the general uk music scenes reluctance to accept hardcore music and almost deny its existance never helps.
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Samination
Advanced Member
Sweden
10,215 posts
Joined: Jul, 2004
195 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2017/02/17 : 16:05:47
+100
quote:
Originally posted by djDMS:
As strange as it may sound, I think there's too much going on.
Too many artists, too many events, too many little groups within groups - most of which don't or won't work together.
There isnt a shortage of talent and dedicated individuals, but there is a massive surplus of hangers-on and self proclaimed big boys who really wouldn't be missed.
I, for one wouldn't be at all bothered by the 'scene' becoming much smaller and more focused before it tries to grow again.
Big branches on a small tree, or small branches on a big tree - which would you rather be?
__________________________________
---------------------------------------------
Samination, Swedish Hardcore DJ
Happy, UK Hardcore, Freeform, Makina and Gabber
http://samination.se/
---------------------------------------------
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trippnface
Advanced Member
United States
659 posts
Joined: Jan, 2010
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Posted - 2017/02/17 : 20:10:52
quote:
Originally posted by CDJay:
I get the cynicism. I really do.
Few things to bear in mind:
- Q1 is, and nearly always has been, release light. Think back to AATW / Ministry release times. Look at when we've put projects out over the past 3 years.
- Whilst I'd be wary of calling 2017 "Hardcore's Year" (I think this is quite 2001-2002 -ey, personally) it's very different to 2015. There have been two massively well attended parties in the UK at the tail end of 2016, and even the January event was busier than the bulk of events in 2015. There's an actual influx UK side of both re-engaged and new followers.
- The HH album was essentially a proof of concept, which worked better than expected. We'd targeted a 3 month sell through on physical. We were caught out in terms of subsequent digital rollout. Our next projects will build on this. We're hoping for 1500-2000 in the medium term, and I believe 5000 is feasible with the right brand/project/release timeline.
- Using our model/platform, per track earnings on 2000 units are directly comparable to tens of thousands of units through traditional distro/vendor models. It sounds soulless, but the reality is that demonstrating that makes it far easier to license material *particularly* using the mix+singles model that I think is now going to become standard.
I totally agree with the idea that singles should also have general public friendly "edits" and indeed that is what will happen as the HH album hits other sites. For fetishists, the HU site will offer both.
We'll be rolling out some re-mastered back cat and albums to streaming vendors, but its definitely not a priority. You'd need 4 *million* plays on Spotify to match the revenue generated by the HH album as a physical release.
Gammer + Styles are doing a U.S tour imminently, and we're working on an international tour of our own for Q3. Sad to say that perception remains as, if not more, important than anything else so the more high profile things even peripherally related to the genre the better.
I think the UK scene will be doubled in terms of ravers and potentially listeners, over the next year. The sky is the limit, on the international side. I've been saying for years that making things slightly less UK dependant is necessary for the genre to thrive again and it seems that some actual effort might now be expended on that. It's also fair to say that "media" will be prioritised and hopefully done to a higher standard than ever before. This is crucial for engagement of potential new generations.
CDJay
woot!
I will be taking a break from this epic psytrance year to attend the HU party in LA on april 7th. got another invite to the mojave; but no ****ing way i am missing the HU party!!
fkn AOS !!
and ... you brining me Entity CDJay!?! ;)
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(A)☮(E)
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Bring Me Round To Love
Starting Member
United Kingdom
15 posts
Joined: Mar, 2016
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Posted - 2017/02/18 : 09:23:09
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Triceps:
quote:
Originally posted by CDJay:
(I think this is quite 2001-2002 -ey, personally)
Wow, I remember the buzz and excitement of that time like it was yesterday - it was literally almost half my life ago.
I remember thinking it was all over when events were scrapping hardcore and there was next to nothing being released, I was buying tape packs and hearing all the same tunes repeatedly, then suddenly - boom! UK hardcore was born!
Agreed, those of us that stuck with Hardcore in 99 and a few more years after where awaiting a even bigger surprise for being loyal, new sound, new direction, and for me looking back and even at the time you could see it was special, a buzz in the air, the second phase maybe even better then the 90's which i would have never thought would have happened.
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Bring Me Round To Love
Starting Member
United Kingdom
15 posts
Joined: Mar, 2016
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Posted - 2017/02/18 : 21:06:11
quote:
Originally posted by DJ Sketchy:
quote:
Originally posted by Bring Me Round To Love:
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Triceps:
quote:
Originally posted by CDJay:
(I think this is quite 2001-2002 -ey, personally)
Wow, I remember the buzz and excitement of that time like it was yesterday - it was literally almost half my life ago.
I remember thinking it was all over when events were scrapping hardcore and there was next to nothing being released, I was buying tape packs and hearing all the same tunes repeatedly, then suddenly - boom! UK hardcore was born!
Agreed, those of us that stuck with Hardcore in 99 and a few more years after where awaiting a even bigger surprise for being loyal, new sound, new direction, and for me looking back and even at the time you could see it was special, a buzz in the air, the second phase maybe even better then the 90's which i would have never thought would have happened.
Well I caught the tail end of Happy Hardcore, and loved it! I remember the days when Hardcore was struggling just after and it was in the tiny room at Camden Palace. I'll never forget a room tightly packed with about 300 ravers singing tunes back to Vibes! There was SUCH an atmosphere in that room. Then the scene quite quickly gained its ground and started developing again.
Back then though pretty much all the big boys were intertwined with it. That's not really happened this time round. Don't get me wrong, there are still quite a few big names present at the moment though. Just records were still big then, and everyone stuck to their release schedules, as people were still buying records.
Back onto the boom after Happy Hardcore with the UK Hardcore sound was just immense. I loved when I was running my coaches about once a month after about 2005, and I saw some wild, huge raves and pretty much every HTID. It was awesome! Id say I preferred the UK Hardcore peak, as I saw all of it! I loved the wild freedom I experienced at the Happy Hardcore peak though.
Miss those days for sure, hope your new album has some early/mid 00's influence.
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Vladel
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
999 posts
Joined: Feb, 2008
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Posted - 2017/02/19 : 10:04:10
My morale with the state of releases is pretty low atm to be honest and like CDjay says, early in the year is pretty release light but i think it goes beyond that. It's funny to me that for most of 2013-2015 lethal theory were banging out the albums. Since they (Joey & Kurt) started their subscription service to get "releases" early should probably have been worded "at all". From the previews make you stomp seemed a bit flat and that was all we got last year as i don't really credit lethal theory with the M-project stuff as most of that comes out of terraform anyway.
Hixxy has been producing but he's TWR so we will likely never see them. Speahow to make it king of which i think TWR might be dead if the releases are anything to go by and that Gammer & Styles are now on monstercat. I have no idea if their first track will actually be released anywhere else.
Freeform has to be utter dead or deaths door without the relentless Thumpa to push it. Transcend and the others were discussing on facebook how to make it more popular again and if anything the consensus was take it further away from UK hardcore which is kind of saying "lets cut our hand off and it will work much better". Freeform worked best when it shadowed uk hardcore and crossed over. The only man now who seems to do that is gammer although the snobby freeform scene probably wouldn't class that stuff as anything to do with freeform.
We've lost some big producing names and returns haven't really panned out. The Sy & Unknown split still stings and i haven't seen anythuing from unknown for a while now (no great loss). Nothing from brisk, Bananaman hasn't really panned out, recon has gone, squad-e is on GTYM so we will never hear anything from him. IYF & nobody were promising but went to shit really, rescue hasn't done much, the list goes on.
Again it's up to HU to do everything it seems with regard to releases because at the end of the day, you can have big raves and lots of online mixes and stuff like that but if none of it is released, it's all a bit sharkey i.e a waste of hope and effort.
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remain calm do not be alarmed do not attempt to leave the dancefloor
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arpz
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
614 posts
Joined: Aug, 2012
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Posted - 2017/02/19 : 14:01:11
Brisk was only talking about his new artist album the other day :)
__________________________________
music - http://www.soundcloud.com/arpz stupid - http://fikshun.me
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Samination
Advanced Member
Sweden
10,215 posts
Joined: Jul, 2004
195 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2017/02/19 : 20:33:40
how to make freeform great again? Easy. Make it hard, not chillout with LONG bloody mixable section and short melodic section... The melodic sections aren't much longer than what 'Happy' Hardcore is right now, but the 2 minute intro's and 2 minute outro's are friggin boring to mix nowadays. I'm no big player in any scene's (only been making mixes since 2003 but hey, I aint sucking dick to get anywhere :)), but I am seriously considering dumping freeform completly too...
__________________________________
---------------------------------------------
Samination, Swedish Hardcore DJ
Happy, UK Hardcore, Freeform, Makina and Gabber
http://samination.se/
---------------------------------------------
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Edited by - Samination on 2017/02/19 20:35:00 |
Elipton
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
923 posts
Joined: Apr, 2013
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Posted - 2017/02/20 : 08:41:46
Freeform's getting a lot of stick which I think is a bit unfair. It's not beyond making a strong recovery. I think it's gone a little too far from Hardcore, and it's lost most of the up-beat, care-free vibe that it was founded upon (I use Freeformation as the perfect benchmark). Perhaps it's lost it's personality?
The music being released isn't by any means bad, it's just moved itself into even more of a niche than it was before, and I think that's unwittingly hurt it more than it's helped it. ILHB started 5 years ago, so it's disappointing that they rely on Kevin Energy or Scott Brown guest mixes to headline. It'll be interesting to see what shape it's in after not attending ILHB since 2013
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