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Dj Fonz
Junior Member
United Kingdom
120 posts
Joined: Mar, 2007
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 Posted - 2007/05/26 : 18:04:39
^^^read the question then reply
Uses nothing more than a pc!
I had final scratch and as far as i am aware you need to use TT's or CDJ's
Correct? Yes i know i am!
Anyway that a old link kid, richie hawtin has been using SSL for ages now!
Richie hawtin set up the last few times i have saw him spin
1 laptop running ableton
1 laptop running serato scratch live
Now tell me what do you use to control SSL?
exactly TT's or CDJ's
So the conclusion, nice try but next time try harder!
Proof...........................
http://www.ableton.com/pages/artists/richie_hawtin
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Edited by - Dj Fonz on 2007/05/26 18:37:04 |
Dj Fonz
Junior Member
United Kingdom
120 posts
Joined: Mar, 2007
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Posted - 2007/05/26 : 18:08:19
quote:
Originally posted by Underloop:
quote:
Originally posted by Dj Fonz:
I asked this question twice already and am still awaiting an answer, name me a famous dj that goes to the club and uses nothing more than a pc!
Liam Howlett?
Luke Vibert
Heard somewhere that Alex Kid has done a digital set
Theres more, these are just a few names that spring to mind.
*edit* Traktor users http://www.native-instruments.com/index.php?id=traktor3artists_us
Never even heard of the first 2 so IMO cant be that famous! Any more?
Alex kid last time i saw him play am afraid to say he wasn't using a laptop:(
And doing "A" digital set is quite a bit different than doing that week in week out, would you not agree?
So still waiting....................
*edit*
http://www.musiquescd.com/flashback/images/tohubohu/lukevibert.jpg
What are those strange things in front of him? hmmmmm
And who is this other, the guy from the prodigy? dj? since when? famous dj? nah more like famous producer! He aint exactly a headliner is he?
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Edited by - Dj Fonz on 2007/05/26 18:44:50 |
Underloop
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
3,895 posts
Joined: Mar, 2002
91 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2007/05/26 : 19:02:05
quote:
Originally posted by Dj Fonz:
quote:
Originally posted by Underloop:
Liam Howlett?
Luke Vibert
Heard somewhere that Alex Kid has done a digital set
Theres more, these are just a few names that spring to mind.
*edit* Traktor users http://www.native-instruments.com/index.php?id=traktor3artists_us
Never even heard of the first 2 so IMO cant be that famous! Any more?
Alex kid last time i saw him play am afraid to say he wasn't using a laptop:(
And doing "A" digital set is quite a bit different than doing that week in week out, would you not agree?
So still waiting....................
Oh, well if its got to be someone who uses computers as their only tool, who is also a big name then it could be a struggle. They are usually DJs who like to experiment, and as such won't limit themselves to one tool.
Luke Vibert is from the same league as Richie Hawtin. He has many aliases such as Wagon Christ. Pretty sure though he doesn't limit himself to just a PC though - he'll probably use synths, samplers, decks, random instruments, speak n spells etc in his sets. Guess that rules him out!
And similarly with Liam Howlett. If you want to familiarise yourself with some of his stuff then you can grab it in pretty much any record store. I reccomend Fat of the Land and Music For The Jilted Generation ;-) He does an awesome live show, but you have to be more into the music than what he uses to entertain.
It really annoys me that people can feel so passionately about a DJ being vinyl only. That would tend to imply that they have strong feelings about music, but by feeling so strongly about being vinyl-only, they are neglecting what the DJ really does, and that is to play music in such a manner as to entertain people. Its totally contradictory.
Saying that though theres been snobbery like this throughout musical history.
a) Electronic instruments can't make real music
b) "Keep music live" (when tapes came in for those too young)
c) When CDs came into play, the snobbery against digital recordings by so-called purists (I guess this is part of the same argument)
I shall leave this post with a question:
Which is the better DJ:
a) The guy who uses a laptop on stage and performs a fantastic mashup set completely live from the raw samples/loops/pellas etc
OR
b) The guy who produces exactly the same set by pulling together tunes in his home studio and burning them to CD and then taking these individual tunes to the club and mixing them on CDJs (or producing dubplates for the vinyl purists)
answers on a postcard please to.....
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we grow old because we stop playing."
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Meph751
Advanced Member
United States
1,488 posts
Joined: Dec, 2005
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Posted - 2007/05/26 : 19:31:19
since this is all opinions, i guess i'll throw mine in there
to start off i'd like to say, you gotta remember it's all about the final product... the dj's job is to make the music sound good.
if i hand you a cd, you're mostly likely not going to be able to tell (aside from maybe having tracks not on vinyl, or the vinyl pops) whether or not it's played off vinyl, so does it really matter?
that being said, a retarded monkey with a pc and virtual dj can beatmatch (seriously, it took me all of 5 minutes to figure out how to do that, having never tried before), so that takes a lot away from the technical aspect of it, the waveforms make it so easy. waveforms, however, don't make your mix sound good, that's entirely up to the dj mixing. i seem to get the impression some people think pc mixing is simply pressing a button and letting the program actually mix for you. to those who think that, go download a trial version, slap two songs on, and let it automix. it won't take you long to see how wrong you are... 
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DJ-Pure
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,739 posts
Joined: Dec, 2005
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Posted - 2007/05/26 : 19:48:33
quote:
Originally posted by kathryn:
What makes a good dj?
Its like the tune 'keep the crowd jumping'
You just got to be able to mix well, have the timing right, play the sounds the crowd wanna hear and if the crowds wild you know u done it
I'm not sure whether to class my self a good DJ but I've never had complaints, The style i mix is like ASA & S1 - Trance Overload, the kind of music that gets you're blood pumping, so i personal aim to keep the building effect with no long intervals of beats, basically i drop from one track to the next tracks main break down, and then from that main break down to the next main break down, that way that vibe just builds and repeats, i also stick in fills of DnB now and again to give the crowd something to cool down to while i find an appropriate track for the next mix.
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Edited by - DJ-Pure on 2007/05/26 21:23:16 |
clarke101
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
3,839 posts
Joined: Jun, 2003
185 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2007/05/26 : 20:16:41
Sasha is possible one of the biggest dj's in the world and use Live exclusively
quote:
Well known the world over for his DJing and remix artistry, Sasha performs exclusively with Ableton Live—a move that has cemented the idea of DJing, remixing and "editing on the fly" with Live for many of the world's leading house, breaks and trance DJs
http://www.ableton.com/pages/artists/sasha
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Edited by - clarke101 on 2007/05/26 20:19:19 |
Samination
Advanced Member
Sweden
13,227 posts
Joined: Jul, 2004
195 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2007/05/26 : 22:04:34
If i where to use 2 Winamp instances, bth with timestretching plugins, would you call me a DJ then? since I have no means of beatmatching the tracks perferctly?
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Happy, UK Hardcore, Freeform, Makina and Gabber
http://samination.se/
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Dj Fonz
Junior Member
United Kingdom
120 posts
Joined: Mar, 2007
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Posted - 2007/05/27 : 07:38:26
quote:
Originally posted by clarke101:
Sasha is possible one of the biggest dj's in the world and use Live exclusively
quote:
Well known the world over for his DJing and remix artistry, Sasha performs exclusively with Ableton Live—a move that has cemented the idea of DJing, remixing and "editing on the fly" with Live for many of the world's leading house, breaks and trance DJs
http://www.ableton.com/pages/artists/sasha
Yes i was waiting for someone to mention that, again i refer you back to the original question "uses nothing more than a pc" now i already know sasha uses more but read the link you posted, now you tell me are you sure all he uses is a laptop?
Nice try! NEXT................
As i stated earlier i have not used PC-DJ but i read up on it and to even compare that to ableton is crazy, the difference in they two programs is like night and day!
And just so you know IMO if when you are using ableton all you are doing is beat matching then no ****ing way you are a dj! It does it for you and before you say dont trust auto mix no program can beat match right watch the tutorial dvd's showing you how to work ableton then try! Perfect everytime!
I heard sasha doing the radio 1 essentail mix using ableton and although it was not to my musical tatse i will say the man can do some great stuff with that program, but is he a dj? IMO when doing that no! But i know when he uses TT/CDJ's he is an incredibly skilled dj
As i said before this is my opinion onthe subject if you don't like it well tough s... 
But seriously if you can get gigs playing nothing more than a pc good luck to you, i ain't knocking your game, go there and rock the place!
I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on this 1
@underloop yes of course we know which is better but if you building it from scratch using loops, beats, acapellas, samples and whatever i would not calss that as djing more like producing on the fly! My definition of a dj is someone that mixes pre made songs, ok you can edit them a bit on the fly but i think you will know what i am saying. Again this is only IMO
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Edited by - Dj Fonz on 2007/05/27 07:52:01 |
Dj Fonz
Junior Member
United Kingdom
120 posts
Joined: Mar, 2007
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Posted - 2007/05/27 : 07:53:25
quote:
Originally posted by DjSamination:
If i where to use 2 Winamp instances, bth with timestretching plugins, would you call me a DJ then? since I have no means of beatmatching the tracks perferctly?
Haha cluthing at straws now:P
1200/1210's come on you know you want to
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Underloop
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
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Joined: Mar, 2002
91 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2007/05/27 : 07:54:30
quote:
Originally posted by Dj Fonz:
I suppose what it comes down to is that is your are using a program to do it for you then IMO your cheating
What if you use a computer, but don't use the auto beat match functions? Would you grant DJ status for that?
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"We don't stop playing because we grow old;
we grow old because we stop playing."
- George Bernard Shaw
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Samination
Advanced Member
Sweden
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Joined: Jul, 2004
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Posted - 2007/05/27 : 08:23:38
When it comes down to it, I dont think the masses really care about on what format you play the tracks in. Like kathryn stated earlier, the trackselection is way more important then that it's pure TT's or CDJ's.
It's your opinion on what makes a DJ, and if we where to make yet another poll about this, I'd think Trackselection > TT's
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quote:
Originally posted by Underloop:
quote:
Originally posted by Dj Fonz:
I suppose what it comes down to is that is your are using a program to do it for you then IMO your cheating
What if you use a computer, but don't use the auto beat match functions? Would you grant DJ status for that?
Only time I've been forced to use auto beat match is when I have to use a track that has no silence in the beginning of the track (if I want the track to play head on instead of having that track at quiet)
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Samination, Swedish Hardcore DJ
Happy, UK Hardcore, Freeform, Makina and Gabber
http://samination.se/
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Edited by - Samination on 2007/05/27 08:28:00 |
clarke101
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
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Joined: Jun, 2003
185 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2007/05/27 : 10:56:53
quote:
Originally posted by Dj Fonz:
quote:
Originally posted by clarke101:
Sasha is possible one of the biggest dj's in the world and use Live exclusively
quote:
Well known the world over for his DJing and remix artistry, Sasha performs exclusively with Ableton Live—a move that has cemented the idea of DJing, remixing and "editing on the fly" with Live for many of the world's leading house, breaks and trance DJs
http://www.ableton.com/pages/artists/sasha
Snip
I think you wont find many, if any who use a pc solely to dj. The closet i think you will come imo is people like Sasha & BT who use custom made midi controllers.
Most people who use pc's will be using them to enable them to move on from djing to give something in between djing and a PA, more of a live performance.
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Dj Fonz
Junior Member
United Kingdom
120 posts
Joined: Mar, 2007
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Posted - 2007/05/27 : 10:57:23
quote:
Originally posted by DjSamination:
When it comes down to it, I dont think the masses really care about on what format you play the tracks in. Like kathryn stated earlier, the trackselection is way more important then that it's pure TT's or CDJ's.
It's your opinion on what makes a DJ, and if we where to make yet another poll about this, I'd think Trackselection > TT's
----------------------------------------
quote:
Originally posted by Underloop:
quote:
Originally posted by Dj Fonz:
I suppose what it comes down to is that is your are using a program to do it for you then IMO your cheating
What if you use a computer, but don't use the auto beat match functions? Would you grant DJ status for that?
Only time I've been forced to use auto beat match is when I have to use a track that has no silence in the beginning of the track (if I want the track to play head on instead of having that track at quiet)
I would class that as cheating, if i understand you right you mean drop mixing? Which i can do on vinyl and cds
Yes i would quite believe a poll on this site would result in a track selection winning, but again thats not evidence, the reason i would say that is is due to the majority of user on this forum probably are to young, **** some ever think rankin and cammy are djs! Therefore i would take any poll results on this site with alot more than just a pinch of salt!
You want a laugh, go to the forums for SSL, torq, pioneer, denon, etc and tell them that your a real dj cause you use pc-dj (i'd acutally expect the mods to ban you on some of them any way)
@underloop to be honest even if you have not used the auto bpm function i would still say it is cheating, have you ever tried ableton? If not try that and see for your self i believe you can d/l a trial version from the site (at least it use to be there)
Ok it is hard at the start when first learning the program but then after that its a peice of piss to use for standard mixing tracks, chopping the tracks up and effects and what not are a little harder but after time they come as well
But hey all i have said is IMO
I own ableton but when i have been doing gigs never once have i taken it, i only have 1 laptop and i use SSL 100% of the time on my home set up i have tried having it running on my desktop while using SSL this can be fun but i would never chose ableton on it own over just TT's, i suppose what it really comes down to 1. i believe it is cheating and 2. no matter how good it sounds clicking on the mouse and pushing a few keys aint no where near the buzz of blending live, putting in some EFX, scratching! When i spin i normally jump about like a man possesed and as much as i like ableton and what it can do it just aint as fulfilling and the buzz i personnally get from seeing people enjoying my mixing ableton or any software i have tried doesn't compare!
What would you rather do at a gig, sit in a chair and stare at your screen or actually have your hands on the equipment and doing the stuff for real?
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Edited by - Dj Fonz on 2007/05/27 11:10:00 |
Dj Fonz
Junior Member
United Kingdom
120 posts
Joined: Mar, 2007
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Posted - 2007/05/27 : 11:03:07
quote:
Originally posted by clarke101:
Most people who use pc's will be using them to enable them to move on from djing to give something in between djing and a PA, more of a live performance.
Ok finally someone is starting to see sense!!
Using a laptop then and your are using it to it potential but PC-DJ **** no, that shit is lame!
@DjSamination
Now i am curious have you had any real gigs using only pc-dj? not friends or realtives private parties. Have you actually been hired by a club owner/promoter for a gig? If so details pls
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Underloop
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Posted - 2007/05/27 : 11:47:14
quote:
Originally posted by Dj Fonz:
Yes i would quite believe a poll on this site would result in a track selection winning, but again thats not evidence, the reason i would say that is is due to the majority of user on this forum probably are to young, **** some ever think rankin and cammy are djs!
Well your pretty mistaken about this forum in that case, and as such I would take any assumptions you make about the people on this forum with a pinch of salt ;-)
quote:
@underloop to be honest even if you have not used the auto bpm function i would still say it is cheating, have you ever tried ableton? If not try that and see for your self i believe you can d/l a trial version from the site (at least it use to be there)
Ok it is hard at the start when first learning the program but then after that its a peice of piss to use for standard mixing tracks, chopping the tracks up and effects and what not are a little harder but after time they come as well
But hey all i have said is IMO
I own ableton but when i have been doing gigs never once have i taken it, i only have 1 laptop and i use SSL 100% of the time on my home set up i have tried having it running on my desktop while using SSL this can be fun but i would never chose ableton on it own over just TT's, i suppose what it really comes down to 1. i believe it is cheating and 2. no matter how good it sounds clicking on the mouse and pushing a few keys aint no where near the buzz of blending live, putting in some EFX, scratching! When i spin i normally jump about like a man possesed and as much as i like ableton and what it can do it just aint as fulfilling and the buzz i personnally get from seeing people enjoying my mixing ableton or any software i have tried doesn't compare!
What would you rather do at a gig, sit in a chair and stare at your screen or actually have your hands on the equipment and doing the stuff for real?
Sorry, I was talking broadly about PC use when mixing rather than narrowly onto Ableton.
Yes, I have messed with Live when messing around with bootlegs. I've never tried using it for DJing. But surely though that wouldn't come under the categry of "not using auto-beatmatching".
As a bit better example, let me talk you through my DJing musicplaying setup.
Lets ignore my 2 turntables, one CDJ and sampler for the time being as they will only cloud the issue. Some sets I use them exclusively, some sets I use them alongside my PC, and other times I use my PC exclusively, so here is my PC-mixing setup.
1 PC running Traktor. Within the PC I have an M-Audio Delta 1010LT. That gives me 8 analogue outs, which I use as 4 stereo outs in Traktor - one for each "deck". I don't use the mixer in Traktor, but I could easily do so. Instead I route all the outputs to the inputs on my mixer.
Within Traktor, I have all the keys mapped. Space plays/cues, number keys switch between decks, cursor keys I use for pitch control (up/down increases/decreases speed, left/right nudges the tune, ctrl+cursor is for fine adjustments). Theres others, but those are the main ones. Not sure how that is that different from hitting keys on a CDJ - I guess theres no slider though. Auto-BPM is not used *ever*.
Effects-wise, I use a mix of built in Traktor effects and effects on my mixer. Again, I could live without.
Now, if I wanted to do away with my mixer, I could quite easily do all my mixing in Traltor. Fasers can be mapped to keys, or I think (or at least if you can't it needs to be added to the next release!) you can do something with the mouse without having to look at the screen - eg ctrl+mouse etc.
The only time I use the screen/mouse is track selection.
As for jumping around - imagine if you weren't limited by your CDJ/Technics being a big heavy thing that was wired into the mixer, and it was say the the size of a wireless keyboard?
Similar to you though, this is only my opinion, and in your eyes I would not be classed with this ultimate status of DJ (I don't use it anyway anymore). I will still arry on making/playing usic. If people like it then great, if not who cares. Whilst I don't agree with people using auto-bpm functions as such, if somebody uses auto-bpm so that they can free up some time to be doing something else in the mix then I have absolutely no problem whatsoever with that. I have a friend who is doing alot of good stuff with electro in London right now who plays out using Ableton. He completely mashes up the mix though, and he doesn't rest even for 10 seconds during a set.
The title "DJ" isn't an honour as such that you can limit who can be called it. At the end of the day there are alot of grey areas, and one thing that should never ever ever be done is to put limits on any art form.
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"We don't stop playing because we grow old;
we grow old because we stop playing."
- George Bernard Shaw
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