| Author |
Thread |
|
TheOneNOnly
Advanced Member
United States
1,937 posts
Joined: Oct, 2008
|
 Posted - 2008/12/11 : 00:35:01
quote:
Originally posted by acidfluxxbass:
quote:
Originally posted by Mental_Adam:
Exactly, They don't give two shits about the genre and they don't care about you! ... just money making. End off. I'm done
that appears to be th trend. but what about the hardcore we love?
is it diminishing?
will there be artists producing to keep it alive?
with AATW monopolising this shack, how will they be funded?
makes you wonder what it'll be like in, say, 10 years time.
Why I'm stocking up on music like it's canned food during the Cold War.
__________________________________
New YouTube Account
The Past, The Present, The Future (CD One)
The Past, The Present, The Future (CD Two)
Alert moderator 
|
acidfluxxbass
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
5,000 posts
Joined: Apr, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 00:55:55
eh the stuff we listen to now will be stuff of myth in the future. hold onto those priceless 12"s if it kills you.
__________________________________
Aka Archefluxx
Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/archefluxx
Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/user/afbofficial
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/archefluxxuk
Alert moderator
|
raindancerob
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,588 posts
Joined: Sep, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 00:58:29
quote:
Originally posted by Mental_Adam:
Exactly, They don't give two shits about the genre and they don't care about you! ... just money making. End off. I'm done
well said mate, i couldnt agree more.
Alert moderator
|
raindancerob
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,588 posts
Joined: Sep, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 00:59:32
quote:
Originally posted by acidfluxxbass:
eh the stuff we listen to now will be stuff of myth in the future. hold onto those priceless 12"s if it kills you.
look at 90s hardcore thats exactly whats happened.
Alert moderator
|
Triquatra
Moderator
United Kingdom
12,640 posts
Joined: Nov, 2003
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 01:15:42
"so what does this mean for us"
nothing - unless you buy the albums and listen to them. cause then you are supporting AATW.
furthermore i was just wondering..you say that labels
"hardly have the funding to promote themselves to existing or new customers"
as if at some point in the past they did??? and its been ripped from them..
was it in 2000 that they had all this funding?
cause i distinctly remember walking around in 2000 and seeing all those kniteforce albums in the UK top 10 ... .. . wait a second
i hate some of the crap on the new albums as much as the next guy - but seriously - everybody gets into hardcore in different ways, and in 2008/9 AATW will introduce hardcore to millions of people (mainly kids) which half of us started out as: with a hardcore cassette before we were even old enough to go out to a rave, this new generation of listeners will eventually find hardcores history...and the ones who dont? well they'll just go back to listening to scouse house and bounce shit - we didnt want them anyway.
seriously - its a good thing you can complain that one hardcore album is ahead of another hardcore album in the compilation charts - even if one of them is from MOShit and the other from AATWalmart (see what i did there? ;) )
REAL trance is still around even though it went through much the same as Hardcore is...
__________________________________
BEE TRAX ALBUM
TRIQUATRA
Alert moderator
|
Mental_Adam
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
845 posts
Joined: Feb, 2006
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 01:17:23
I disagree, back then there wasn't mp3 and things were done the hard way...
Todays material can be downloaded instantly through legal websites, Any vinyl from early 90s available? not much of it ... It'll always be treasure to be found.
History won't repeat itself.
It'll be easy to access as it is today.
__________________________________
Alert moderator
|
raindancerob
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,588 posts
Joined: Sep, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 01:35:33
quote:
Originally posted by Mental_Adam:
I disagree, back then there wasn't mp3 and things were done the hard way...
Todays material can be downloaded instantly through legal websites, Any vinyl from early 90s available? not much of it ... It'll always be treasure to be found.
History won't repeat itself.
It'll be easy to access as it is today.
i agree about downloading, however 90s hardcore vinyl aint that hard to come by if you know where to look 
Alert moderator
|
acidfluxxbass
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
5,000 posts
Joined: Apr, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 02:17:49
a changing market share and monopoly along with the illegal downloading all deals damage. the losses grow and it becomes a major financial problem.
__________________________________
Aka Archefluxx
Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/archefluxx
Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/user/afbofficial
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/archefluxxuk
Alert moderator
|
Trimms
Senior Member
United States
494 posts
Joined: Aug, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 03:12:14
Don't be so dramatic. Just because some zitty tween thinks hardcore is a "I Kissed A Girl and I Liked It" remix doesn't mean it actually is. Real hardcore will never die, you just won't find it beautifully packaged on store shelves. To be honest, I'm glad AATW is taking commerical hardcore in the direction it is. It just separates it from true hardcore even more.
Have you not looked at the advantages of this situation? By AATW having a monopoly on commerical hardcore, we can in turn;
- support hardcore artists on their own labels
- keep real hardcore the underground phenomenon it always has been
- put more distance between real ravers and night-clubbers
The disadvantage is that "well, I've been on the scene for ages and true ravers would never like this stuff, this is commercial crap for kids." That seems to be the focal point of every "Hixxy is crap" or "CXH sux bawls" argument on this forum. Your elitist point of view is what is bringing hardcore down. The big names read these boards and feel the hate, but do they do anything about it? No. So don't give them the attention they want. Let them have it from 13-year old raver-wannabes.
I am a Darren Styles fan (for the most part).
I am a Hixxy fan.
But, I think Sharkey's freeform is some of the greatest hardcore around.
I would blow Scott Brown.
Kurt can take my hand in marriage, and Neophyte can be my best man.
I have varying tastes and I enjoy all of the scene. But I know that I will always enjoy Scott Brown over Styles any day. If your only idea of "real hardcore" is a great packaged & wrapped box on a shelf, then you are very wrong. Just look at the releases on this website. It's right in front of you. AATW isn't assimilating anything - in fact, they're not destroying at all. They're creating. Creating a new brand of hardcore that "true ravers" (seriously?) can never enjoy.
If you don't like it, don't listen to it. Problem solved.
__________________________________
www.myspace.com/djtrimms
Alert moderator
|
raindancerob
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,588 posts
Joined: Sep, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 03:31:44
quote:
Originally posted by Trimms:
If you don't like it, don't listen to it. Problem solved.
init hence why i stopped listening to new uk hardcore in 2000, cuz thats when it went shit.
Alert moderator
|
Rayovac
Advanced Member
United States
2,049 posts
Joined: Jan, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 03:52:05
quote:
Originally posted by Trimms:
Don't be so dramatic. Just because some zitty tween thinks hardcore is a "I Kissed A Girl and I Liked It" remix doesn't mean it actually is. Real hardcore will never die, you just won't find it beautifully packaged on store shelves. To be honest, I'm glad AATW is taking commerical hardcore in the direction it is. It just separates it from true hardcore even more.
Have you not looked at the advantages of this situation? By AATW having a monopoly on commerical hardcore, we can in turn;
- support hardcore artists on their own labels
- keep real hardcore the underground phenomenon it always has been
- put more distance between real ravers and night-clubbers
The disadvantage is that "well, I've been on the scene for ages and true ravers would never like this stuff, this is commercial crap for kids." That seems to be the focal point of every "Hixxy is crap" or "CXH sux bawls" argument on this forum. Your elitist point of view is what is bringing hardcore down. The big names read these boards and feel the hate, but do they do anything about it? No. So don't give them the attention they want. Let them have it from 13-year old raver-wannabes.
I am a Darren Styles fan (for the most part).
I am a Hixxy fan.
But, I think Sharkey's freeform is some of the greatest hardcore around.
I would blow Scott Brown.
Kurt can take my hand in marriage, and Neophyte can be my best man.
I have varying tastes and I enjoy all of the scene. But I know that I will always enjoy Scott Brown over Styles any day. If your only idea of "real hardcore" is a great packaged & wrapped box on a shelf, then you are very wrong. Just look at the releases on this website. It's right in front of you. AATW isn't assimilating anything - in fact, they're not destroying at all. They're creating. Creating a new brand of hardcore that "true ravers" (seriously?) can never enjoy.
If you don't like it, don't listen to it. Problem solved.
If this forum had a karma system you would get +3 for that mate. :o
I actually feel kind of stupid for what I said now. 
__________________________________
"The individual member of the social community often receives his information via visual, symbolic channels."
This also means "People read."
Alert moderator
|
acidfluxxbass
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
5,000 posts
Joined: Apr, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 07:37:00
quote:
Originally posted by Trimms:
Don't be so dramatic. Just because some zitty tween thinks hardcore is a "I Kissed A Girl and I Liked It" remix doesn't mean it actually is. Real hardcore will never die, you just won't find it beautifully packaged on store shelves. To be honest, I'm glad AATW is taking commerical hardcore in the direction it is. It just separates it from true hardcore even more.
Have you not looked at the advantages of this situation? By AATW having a monopoly on commerical hardcore, we can in turn;
- support hardcore artists on their own labels
- keep real hardcore the underground phenomenon it always has been
- put more distance between real ravers and night-clubbers
The disadvantage is that "well, I've been on the scene for ages and true ravers would never like this stuff, this is commercial crap for kids." That seems to be the focal point of every "Hixxy is crap" or "CXH sux bawls" argument on this forum. Your elitist point of view is what is bringing hardcore down. The big names read these boards and feel the hate, but do they do anything about it? No. So don't give them the attention they want. Let them have it from 13-year old raver-wannabes.
I am a Darren Styles fan (for the most part).
I am a Hixxy fan.
But, I think Sharkey's freeform is some of the greatest hardcore around.
I would blow Scott Brown.
Kurt can take my hand in marriage, and Neophyte can be my best man.
I have varying tastes and I enjoy all of the scene. But I know that I will always enjoy Scott Brown over Styles any day. If your only idea of "real hardcore" is a great packaged & wrapped box on a shelf, then you are very wrong. Just look at the releases on this website. It's right in front of you. AATW isn't assimilating anything - in fact, they're not destroying at all. They're creating. Creating a new brand of hardcore that "true ravers" (seriously?) can never enjoy.
If you don't like it, don't listen to it. Problem solved.
you raise solid points, but i'm sure people said that about old skool happy hardcore music when bonkers released bonkers 7. nonetheless, that particular style of music dimished under a wave of revelling hardcore fans liking the 'new skool transey sound'.
As music evolves, which is does and will, styles change and music changes to fit what people seem to like. The point i tried to raise is that main stream hardcore seems to be the thing that makes money and AATW are releasing big albums based around this hard-dance kinda stuff.
There are also push and pull factors that tempt other hardcore producers to follow the same route. people may find it hard to believe that sharkey would ever go mainstream or kevin energy starting doing remixes of the UK top 40 charts, but thats not to say it wouldn't happen.
If you remember, Sharkey used to make the old stuff on the early bonkers. How things have chnaged since then. Now he's making freeform, UK Hardcore - the works.
In this day and age theres allot to tempt existing hardcore producers to mainstream if it makes the money
pulling factors
- We've seen AATW have huge success with the hardcore extreme albums
- There seems to be a bigger market for that type of music
- Safety net. make a success of yourself in main-stream hardcore and you can enjoy the successes. You might even do a darren styles sand release an album.
push factors
- no real means of promotion (no cd's on the shelves that showcase some of the works of dj's we see less. sure, we saw cd's like true hardcore 2, hardcore underground, wise up get stupid and other compilations, but how long do they really last on the shelves? I saw Clubland Xtreme Hardcore 4 on the shelves of zavvi and HMV for the majority of last year.
- the credit crunch. economical factors may make the day job's insecure. As a means of extra cash, a dj may make music thats proven to have a bigger fanbase.
- redundancies may cease some dj's (think about it. its happening all over the world. what if a smaller name dj got made redundant? he'd be trying to get a job so he can get food on the table rather than producing. of course he'd probably continue djing as thats extra ££)
- Freeform, Trancecore and other more specific tastes cater for only a handful of people and with main-stream stuff going so big, some may interpret the hardcore we like as dying.
__________________________________
Aka Archefluxx
Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/archefluxx
Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/user/afbofficial
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/archefluxxuk
Alert moderator
|
silver
Admin
Japan
12,579 posts
Joined: Feb, 2001
894 hardcore releases
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 08:21:09
Remember hardcore tie I die is a brand name owned by Hixxy, it's not something AATW took away, Hixxy can release the CD anywhere he likes.
Resist / React went bankrupt, no more bonkers, BUT AATW purchased the name, I would rather a bonkers from AATW than no bonkers at all.
Sharkey is on Bonkers, Scott Brown recently got a bunch of new profile photos done so that might say something and the other DJ is not Breeze, Styles or Hixxy... AATW are keeping tight lipped, I personally only can confirm Sharkey and 1-2 other producers but not sure the config for it yet and if it has changed....
Alert moderator
|
acidfluxxbass
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
5,000 posts
Joined: Apr, 2008
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 08:43:28
well im overjoyed to hear that.
how well bonkers will do under AATW is yet to be seen but we can only show optimism. I'll pledge my support and loyalty by buying it for sure.
htid was published by AATW i htink, wasnt it?
still, I didn't like it and its another example of mainstream hardcore. i recall it not getting exactly the best reception on hhc.com either :/
__________________________________
Aka Archefluxx
Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/archefluxx
Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/user/afbofficial
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/archefluxxuk
Alert moderator
|
Tha Kid Vicious
Starting Member
United States
14 posts
Joined: Jul, 2003
238 hardcore releases
|
Posted - 2008/12/11 : 08:57:17
Fair enough; I DO miss tha days of Dreamscape, Fusion, AND of course tha Wemberly Arena days... But this is MUCH better than a few years ago (end of 1999-2003) when Hardcore was going nowhere fast, and I had to FIGHT to get any bookings (free bookings, BTW; Which is just fine by me, but not when I was having to BEG my best friends for any play time)... Just think about a return to those days, and be thankful for where we are at in that respect... Am I right, or wrong on that point?
PLUS - I REALLY don't care about Mr. DiScalla's other work; He is an EPIC UK Hardcore producer, as is Squad-E... And Darren Styles has been along for tha WHOLE Hardcore ride, up's & down's for over a DOZEN years - Give proper respect where it's due, m8... And it's DEFINATELY due to Darren Mews. 'Nuf said.
Cheers! :)
T-K-V
***Always remember tha reason for tha season - Merry CHRISTmas!!!***
quote:
Originally posted by acidfluxxbass:
AATW Are Assimilating Hardcore As We Know It ...
So what does this mean for us. We've been on the scene from the start or for a long long time. We're seeing AATW release 'hardcore til i die' and 'clubland x-treme hardcore' albums and now they bought rights to the bonkers 18 name in june of this year.
The main commercial hardcore, clubland, bonkers, htid become mainstream. AATW are slowly changing hardcore into a music that suits everyone. This mainstream top-40 remix stuff.
Some will like it. Sure, there are dance fans who find this is more their thing, but we, the true ravers find that hardcore is moving further and further from our desired tastes.
Lets look at htid the album:
Re-con, aka Ultrabeat features hugely and we all know hes more dancey than hardcore. Look at the tracks. A vocal version of Love Garden. A terrible 'God's child' remix using the old scott brown samples. Cascada remixes, Bass Bumpers remixes. Similarly, Squad-E. Alex-K remixes, More cascada, ultrabeat remixes, so on.
I dont even have to start on Darren Styles. We all know that he's the biggest hardcore name, despite pathetic tracks like dicolights.
The recently released CXH5 has received much stick for being another mainstream gaffe.
More disco lights, and the vast majority being dancey vocal stuff rather than the bouncy 'fun' hardcore we loved.
You see, my point is, with Bonkers not being on the shelves in over a year (or two?) and True Hardcore, Hardcore Nation and other albums finding it hard to earn and maintain a place on retailers shelve's, we're missing out on the hardcore that we like.
For example, Scott Brown, Plus System all the other guy's.. we're hearing less and less of them. I mean, sure they have their own labels and they sell tracks from there, but think about how much money they miss out on when Resist go bust and Bonkers stops. Even if Bonkers restarts under AATW, chances are we see Re-Con, DArren Styles and Hixxy Mixing it (again).
Whilst we do have the option of buying the tracks from their labels, many people would be detered and amused by the AATW releases, drawing their attention away from labels. And as far as i can tell, the labels hardly have the funding to promote themselves to existing or new customers about new tracks and what not.
AATW have a rapidly growing market share over Hardcore. They are becoming a monopoly. I went into Zavvi today and what did I see? I saw Hardcore: The Classics, Clubland X Hardcore 5, Htid and the DS album as the only hardcore releases. 3 compilations were AATW releases and they were higher on the album charts than Hardcore the classics, by a long way.
Hardcore revels in a huge burst of interest - thats obvious. However, thats mainly generated by mainstream hardcore that has changed to suit the majority of people. Its bordering on dance for christ sake.
What Are Your Thoughts?
I post this at risk of being completely wrong and misproven but this is only what I can tell and what i see happening hardcore.
We might be ok, we have a site that updates us on hardcore news, but thats just a handful of hardcore fans. So many others see this AATW crap and a#fall in love with it leaving our favouite labels struggling for sales, surely.
__________________________________
Cheers! :)
T-K-V
http://www.Ruff-Biznizz.com
Alert moderator
|
|
Printer friendly
